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Author Topic: HOW to Optimize my new map? (48 messages, Page 1 of 2)
Moderators: Dennis

goku
Joined: Aug 12, 2007


Posted: Sep 13, 2007 05:14 PM    Msg. 1 of 48       
Ok my map is almost finished and I've done some tests playing with my frends in LAN game. Some of them have some dificulties when thay play it. At home I have a Nvidia6500-250mb card and I can play it at full fx ect, with no problem. After the tool compile the map is 71mb. I've tried to reduce trees wepons and other stuff but but they dont make any significant difference 1-2mb. Is there any step I have to do before compiling it? Any cliping stuff?










Dennis

Joined: Jan 27, 2005

"We are made of starstuff. ― Carl Sagan


Posted: Sep 13, 2007 05:20 PM    Msg. 2 of 48       
Is the "floating" road part of the BSP or a scenery object?


goku
Joined: Aug 12, 2007


Posted: Sep 13, 2007 05:29 PM    Msg. 3 of 48       
Man it won't be compiled if there was any unwelded vertex. And for the construciton part, I've modeled in the smaller amount of polys posible. I've seen levels like Bloodgoulch ect, they have almast the duble amount of polys and triangles that my map, and still are lighter after compile. Here is some wire wip's of my map during the modeling phase:





I'm sure must be something to solve this.
Edited by goku on Sep 13, 2007 at 05:31 PM


goku
Joined: Aug 12, 2007


Posted: Sep 13, 2007 05:49 PM    Msg. 4 of 48       
Thak you guys for replying.
The "floating" road is part of the BSP. It's not a separated scenery object.
I'm sure it's not the polycoun that makes it heavy in MB. Maybe the radiosity.
What can portals do?


goku
Joined: Aug 12, 2007


Posted: Sep 13, 2007 06:03 PM    Msg. 5 of 48       
No, no portals in my map, because I don't know how to setup them.
I don't know nothing about portals! I have to find a good tutorial to build them.


Orange_Geko
Joined: Nov 19, 2005

How long since I last used this account?


Posted: Sep 13, 2007 06:26 PM    Msg. 6 of 48       
Quote: --- Original message by: goku
No, no portals in my map, because I don't know how to setup them.
I don't know nothing about portals! I have to find a good tutorial to build them.

portals wont help your problem, they are only for things like weather, sound, rendering.

How many tags do you have in your map? because those are what are gonna make your map big


goku
Joined: Aug 12, 2007


Posted: Sep 13, 2007 07:02 PM    Msg. 7 of 48       
Sorry this is my first map and I dont know much about portals, tags, clipping ect.
What do U mean: How many tags... I've skined a couple of warhogs (red & blue), maded some custom textures and that's it. In fact I've copied the entire warhog folder, pasted and renamed almost every element in the new warhog_red folder, and than I've made all the modifications to the textures and varies parameters. Is that making my map heavier ?
Edited by goku on Sep 13, 2007 at 07:03 PM
Edited by goku on Sep 13, 2007 at 07:04 PM


tygron
Joined: Jan 16, 2006

Furry and proud :3


Posted: Sep 13, 2007 07:07 PM    Msg. 8 of 48       
It could be all the graphics. Looks nice but what kinds of problems are the testers having?


goku
Joined: Aug 12, 2007


Posted: Sep 13, 2007 07:20 PM    Msg. 9 of 48       
No, with 250mb card it can be played nice&well, but I'm surprizet from the map size. Halo has way more big maps and they are only 17-20 MB, while mine has reached 71MB in size after tool compile. I want to find a way to make it smaller in size, maybe it will be faster in game too!


Caboose117
Joined: Jul 23, 2006

Seriously guys?


Posted: Sep 13, 2007 08:13 PM    Msg. 10 of 48       
Quote: --- Original message by: goku
No, with 250mb card it can be played nice&well, but I'm surprizet from the map size. Halo has way more big maps and they are only 17-20 MB, while mine has reached 71MB in size after tool compile. I want to find a way to make it smaller in size, maybe it will be faster in game too!


You keep saying 17-20 mb, but yet, I have never seen that low... Maybe you are thinking of the compressed .zip size... 71 mb is not that bad....


Maniac1000
-Helpful Poster-
Joined: Feb 24, 2007


Posted: Sep 13, 2007 08:35 PM    Msg. 11 of 48       
have u tryed the "optimize" tool inn 3ds. or better still "pollygon cruncher" these tools work wonders.there is a tut somewhere for this called somthing opimizing i think its in the wiki tutorial pdf on halomaps. try that and see if it helps but be carefull not to do too much or u will make degenerates who will move in with u and eat the contents of the fridge and lay on the couch all day smoking ur green.


NapalM
Joined: Jul 8, 2007

keke


Posted: Sep 13, 2007 08:59 PM    Msg. 12 of 48       
cause bungie says a mp map should be 10000 faces or less. thats including scenery.


Caboose117
Joined: Jul 23, 2006

Seriously guys?


Posted: Sep 13, 2007 09:01 PM    Msg. 13 of 48       
Quote: --- Original message by: teh ganon
Quote: --- Original message by: Caboose117
Quote: --- Original message by: goku
No, with 250mb card it can be played nice&well, but I'm surprizet from the map size. Halo has way more big maps and they are only 17-20 MB, while mine has reached 71MB in size after tool compile. I want to find a way to make it smaller in size, maybe it will be faster in game too!


You keep saying 17-20 mb, but yet, I have never seen that low... Maybe you are thinking of the compressed .zip size... 71 mb is not that bad....


no some maps get as low as 9 mb. the bungie maps are around 13-16. cmt are over 100 >.>. i think archive is around 50. i made a map called plasma facility a long time ago. was like 70. scenery is mean...


SP maps from bungie are at the least 70mb.... I've copied them many times, I know the files...


H Guru
Joined: Oct 15, 2006

EHSv3 Coming Soon!


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 06:29 AM    Msg. 14 of 48       
How big is the .tif of your ground texture? custom textures that are high res cause a maps size to go up alot


MF Boom
Joined: Mar 5, 2007

I am the bone of my sword...


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 10:29 AM    Msg. 15 of 48       
Quote: --- Original message by: selentic
also, goku, theres no such thing as a 250 MB graphics card

Um, what the hell are YOU smoking? I have an ATI Radeon 9250, and it's 256 MB. There may not be a 250 no, but there's higher than that. o_O; The one I want is 1.5 gb, but it's over $2,000; so it's definitely out of my range. Plus, as my brother just said to me in IM, "if you have AGP you can also share memory to make your video memory more too"... So, yeah. A lot of people have 128mb+ video cards, if they have a video card. On-board cards, of course not, but then you couldn't run Halo anyway. 64mb+ is required last I checked, and most people have higher than that. My cousin just bought a supercomputer for not even around $800 altogether that's got a 640mb video card... Don't mind my ranting, I'm just like...Wow. There really is no such thing as a 250, but a lot of people refer to 256's as 250's, and 512's as 500's. It's common. same with 768's being referred to as 750's, albeit that's rare. See, they list two 512's or a 1024 as a "1 gb" stick, which most people think is 1000 mb. See my point? It's called rounding. But a lot of people have high cards, some have lower, but most people lately have higher calibur cards anymore... If anything, I can get my brother and I to test it out, because my brother's is just a 128, mine's 256, and if it runs slow on our computers, then yeah, there's a problem. >_>; That's all I'm saying... ignore my horrible paragraph styling.


Dennis

Joined: Jan 27, 2005

"We are made of starstuff. ― Carl Sagan


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 10:59 AM    Msg. 16 of 48       
Quote: --- Original message by: teh ganon
scenery is mean...
Especially if you link to it and don't use it in the level population. The level will compile with all the tags you have linked to, not just the ones you placed in the game. So if you add a type of tree using Sapien then decide you don't want that tree but want another unless you unlink the tag the map will compile with it.


Caboose117
Joined: Jul 23, 2006

Seriously guys?


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 11:02 AM    Msg. 17 of 48       
Lol, thats probably why my test map is like 58mb... Plus all the other random stuff that I did use...


Orange_Geko
Joined: Nov 19, 2005

How long since I last used this account?


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 11:09 AM    Msg. 18 of 48       
Quote: --- Original message by: selentic
Quote: --- Original message by: Orange_Geko
Quote: --- Original message by: goku
No, no portals in my map, because I don't know how to setup them.
I don't know nothing about portals! I have to find a good tutorial to build them.

portals wont help your problem, they are only for things like weather, sound, rendering.

How many tags do you have in your map? because those are what are gonna make your map big


Whatre you smoking, portals break up a level to help it run better by allowing it to avoid fully rendering things

it appers your the one thats smoking things, you cant read


Caboose117
Joined: Jul 23, 2006

Seriously guys?


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 11:11 AM    Msg. 19 of 48       
XD Portals are good.....


Dennis

Joined: Jan 27, 2005

"We are made of starstuff. ― Carl Sagan


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 11:20 AM    Msg. 20 of 48       
Quote: --- Original message by: Caboose117
XD Portals are good.....
Portals are used to assist the rendering engine decide what to render. This will increase the frame rate of the map because the game does not need to render things you can't see. For example if you make a building with an indoor area and then an outdoor section. If you dont use portals the game will still render the outdoor areas while you are inside even though you can't see them.


MF Boom
Joined: Mar 5, 2007

I am the bone of my sword...


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 11:52 AM    Msg. 21 of 48       
Quote: --- Original message by: Dennis
Quote: --- Original message by: Caboose117
XD Portals are good.....
Portals are used to assist the rendering engine decide what to render. This will increase the frame rate of the map because the game does not need to render things you can't see. For example if you make a building with an indoor area and then an outdoor section. If you dont use portals the game will still render the outdoor areas while you are inside even though you can't see them.

Hmn, that sounds helpful. Could you link me to a tutorial or information about portals?

Max and I had trouble with one of our maps before, having faces disappear when looking at certain angles, specifically the walls in a maze, but we could see way beyond that, seeing the other walls in the distance. I assume portals would help and only render what we can see, which should, therefore, let us see the walls around us, and not everything else instead. =]


Caboose117
Joined: Jul 23, 2006

Seriously guys?


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 11:53 AM    Msg. 22 of 48       
Quote: --- Original message by: Dennis
Quote: --- Original message by: Caboose117
XD Portals are good.....
Portals are used to assist the rendering engine decide what to render. This will increase the frame rate of the map because the game does not need to render things you can't see. For example if you make a building with an indoor area and then an outdoor section. If you dont use portals the game will still render the outdoor areas while you are inside even though you can't see them.

Therefore, portals are good... Funny how not many people actually use em...

http://nikon.bungie.org/misc/hek_tutorial

It has stuff on portaling in there.
Edited by Caboose117 on Sep 14, 2007 at 11:54 AM


MF Boom
Joined: Mar 5, 2007

I am the bone of my sword...


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 11:55 AM    Msg. 23 of 48       
I should've checked that before, being it's in my favorites. Haha. >_>; Thanks, I'll scan through that now.


goku
Joined: Aug 12, 2007


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 01:00 PM    Msg. 24 of 48       
Thanks for all your replyies. Sorry for the 250mb card, it was a mispelling. I mean 256mb card and I think it's not that much. Cards nowdays tend to be 512mb or higher.
Anyway I want to make my map smaller as to HaloCE maps:
bloodgulch 13mb, hangemhigh 12mb, even sidewinder that's biger than my map is 14mb.
I'll give a try to portals to see if it will increase intractivity in game. If someone knows any good portal tutorial other than that in HaloCE help, please post it!






MF Boom
Joined: Mar 5, 2007

I am the bone of my sword...


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 01:07 PM    Msg. 25 of 48       
Also, when you release a beta, please tell us. I wanna try that map out, that's absolutely amazing. <3


Flash44x
Joined: Jan 3, 2007

What would you have your arbiter do?


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 01:24 PM    Msg. 26 of 48       
ugh
Edited by Fbi Was For on Sep 14, 2007 at 01:25 PM


_TheArbiter_
Joined: Apr 22, 2007

"stupidity is an epidemic " - Donut


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 02:26 PM    Msg. 27 of 48       
Quote: --- Original message by: MF Boom
Quote: --- Original message by: Dennis
Quote: --- Original message by: Caboose117
XD Portals are good.....
Portals are used to assist the rendering engine decide what to render. This will increase the frame rate of the map because the game does not need to render things you can't see. For example if you make a building with an indoor area and then an outdoor section. If you dont use portals the game will still render the outdoor areas while you are inside even though you can't see them.

Hmn, that sounds helpful. Could you link me to a tutorial or information about portals?


the tut the HEK brings has stuff about portals...


BlueBlaze55
Joined: Aug 2, 2007

burn burn...


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 05:34 PM    Msg. 28 of 48       
Quote: --- Original message by: MF Boom
Also, when you release a beta, please tell us. I wanna try that map out, that's absolutely amazing. <3
me too, this map looks AMAZING!!!! i wouldn't be surpised if it's as popular as hugeass and other popular maps


goku
Joined: Aug 12, 2007


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 06:18 PM    Msg. 29 of 48       
Thanks guys for the nice words, but for the moment I need litle help for portals. Does anyone knows any video or text portal tutorial?


Orange_Geko
Joined: Nov 19, 2005

How long since I last used this account?


Posted: Sep 14, 2007 06:20 PM    Msg. 30 of 48       
Quote: --- Original message by: goku
Thanks guys for the nice words, but for the moment I need litle help for portals. Does anyone knows any video or text portal tutorial?

no, but you use the create face mode, create a seal inside all around, and apply the material +exactportal or what ever it is in teh HEK tut (I check the name on the HEK tut everytime I use a portal, because I realy dont care much about the portals that often loL)


goku
Joined: Aug 12, 2007


Posted: Sep 15, 2007 02:56 PM    Msg. 31 of 48       
Thanks man, I'lll give it a try. Is any way to import back all my scenery, decals and other stuff back after compiling the new scenario?


Caboose117
Joined: Jul 23, 2006

Seriously guys?


Posted: Sep 16, 2007 01:14 PM    Msg. 32 of 48       
Use the old scenario, but swap the .bsp using guerilla.


Dennis

Joined: Jan 27, 2005

"We are made of starstuff. ― Carl Sagan


Posted: Sep 16, 2007 02:05 PM    Msg. 33 of 48       
Quote: --- Original message by: MF Boom
Hmn, that sounds helpful. Could you link me to a tutorial or information about portals?

http://hce.halomaps.org/hek/references/level_design/mp_level_design/mp_ld_level_creation_part_02.html Near the bottom of the page


Dennis

Joined: Jan 27, 2005

"We are made of starstuff. ― Carl Sagan


Posted: Sep 16, 2007 07:38 PM    Msg. 34 of 48       
Quote: --- Original message by: l283023
woah i didn't know that you posted the hek tutorial on your site...... why can't people just use the one found in their hce directory?
There is no reason they can't but many don't. They expect to install the HEK and then just click around to make maps. It doesn't work like that.


goku
Joined: Aug 12, 2007


Posted: Sep 30, 2007 11:39 AM    Msg. 35 of 48       
Thanks for the help guys.
Finally some updates to my map. As U may remember I had that problem with the map size and fps performance. I've experimented a little bit with portals and solved some of my problems, but other errors comed to life. First I divaded my map to 5/4 ratio +portal, and my final map size was reduced to 19 MB, and the game performance was 15-17 fps. Don't know but every time I tried to export to .JMS(Blizckriek) with +exactportal linked to the frame, or even attached to the level itself, an export error ocurred and max crashed. I exported the level only with +portal.


I increased the +portal division to 10/17 and compiled the map again.


The map size did'nt changed but the game performance increased to 29-30 fps. At that moment a new wired error apired. I can't see anymore the map, only small parts near to the player are visible.




What is this error, and how to solve it?

 
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