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Author Topic: Lossing more and more editors dont you agree?!?!? (293 messages, Page 6 of 9)
Moderators: Dennis

Skidrow925
Joined: Mar 19, 2010

"ideological sense of respect and tact of a 5yo"


Posted: Oct 21, 2010 10:24 PM    Msg. 176 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: AGLion
Quote: --- Original message by: Skidrow925
It is Illegal?


According to the EULA, yes.

Quote: You may not reverse engineer, decompile, or disassemble the SOFTWARE PRODUCT, except and only to the extent that such activity is expressly permitted by applicable law notwithstanding this limitation.

Quote: The SOFTWARE PRODUCT is licensed as a single product. Its component parts may not be separated for use on more than one computer.


Unless such activity is expressly permitted by applicable law notwithstanding that limitation.


I kinda already screwed the EULA.....

Quote: The SOFTWARE PRODUCT is licensed as a single product. Its component parts may not be separated for use on more than one computer.


What does that have to do with this?

So in short you telling me that M$ is gonna come to my house and arrest me? HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHA
I don't think that's gonna happen...

I also don't think they even care anymore...


-Skidrowa


AGLion
Joined: Jun 29, 2010

- Animator... suck it -


Posted: Oct 21, 2010 10:34 PM    Msg. 177 of 293       
Last quote was just cause it seems like it fit in.

M$ isn't going to come and arrest you, but it's a matter of principle. The EULA is a legal contract between you and a company, and violating that is a breach of contract, akin to breaking a promise. When you accept that contract, you are bound by those rules and decompiling the source code would be breaking that contract.

Of course, they won't come to your house and threaten you if you do, but it's all based on principle. Now, if you decompile the code and that code becomes publicly available/a famous product, then that would be illegal and MS would get pissed.


d4rfnader
Joined: Jul 16, 2010

Open mouth, insert sandwhich.


Posted: Oct 21, 2010 11:27 PM    Msg. 178 of 293       
Yeah, lion's right, if you decompiled the code and leaked it, that would probably mean prison time...or jail time, i'm not sure how it works lol.


Dwood
Joined: Oct 23, 2007

Judge Ye Therefore


Posted: Oct 21, 2010 11:32 PM    Msg. 179 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: AGLion
Quote: --- Original message by: Dwood
You do not know what you are talking about, as both have the same exact effects. I could add a program that is integrated into the game .exe or I could modify it externally. The best choice (as seen by almost ALL halo app developers) has been to modify the game externally.


external programs intercept memory processes and alter them to do what you want them to do. that's how things like timefreeze, alldev and aimbot work. they don't modify the engine.

Yeah they do. That is modifying the stuff in the engine....


Dennis

Joined: Jan 27, 2005

"We are made of starstuff.Ē ― Carl Sagan


Posted: Oct 21, 2010 11:48 PM    Msg. 180 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: AGLion
Of course, they won't come to your house and threaten you if you do,
However they might and have every right to sue you or your parents/legal guardians. That is what copyright laws are about.


Propast
Joined: Sep 1, 2010


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 03:39 AM    Msg. 181 of 293       
I don't think we are losing editors. It's more of people getting older, having more responsibilities. People have life's and get busy with jobs and schools. I'm new here and have learned a lot by myself, but I am too busy make stuff.


Skidrow925
Joined: Mar 19, 2010

"ideological sense of respect and tact of a 5yo"


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 12:37 PM    Msg. 182 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: AGLion
Last quote was just cause it seems like it fit in.

M$ isn't going to come and arrest you, but it's a matter of principle. The EULA is a legal contract between you and a company, and violating that is a breach of contract, akin to breaking a promise. When you accept that contract, you are bound by those rules and decompiling the source code would be breaking that contract.

Of course, they won't come to your house and threaten you if you do, but it's all based on principle. Now, if you decompile the code and that code becomes publicly available/a famous product, then that would be illegal and MS would get pissed.


Which is why I won't tell people how I did it.


Skidrow925
Joined: Mar 19, 2010

"ideological sense of respect and tact of a 5yo"


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 01:39 PM    Msg. 183 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: Sergeant Major
Quote: --- Original message by: d4rfnader
Yeah, lion's right, if you decompiled the code and leaked it, that would probably mean prison time...or jail time, i'm not sure how it works lol.


Jail is where a person suspected or convicted of a crime is held.

Prison is long-time detention for serious crimes against society. It also holds people accused under federal, state, county and/or city laws.

That being said, and Microsoft's influence and their being uptight about even pirating a 2$ game, I'd say Prison.

But yes, you have no right whatsoever tampering with a product under a EULA, so their actions are justified. If you have done anything illegal, please don't brag about it. I'm sure at least one M$ employee will search on a whim in the near future.

On the other hand, it's a 9 year old game. There is zero profit for Microsoft anymore, it seems they're just being stubborn. Maybe they fear someone will reproduce it?

Halo: Pirates Evolved



So people want something illegal? Not that that is anything new...

Theoretically if I asked M$ for rights to mod it and they let me...


SeanTheLawn
Joined: Sep 4, 2007


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 01:45 PM    Msg. 184 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: jesse
one day i'm going to make an extremely detailed tutorial on how to make HUDs. It will cover weapon interfaces, unit interfaces, grenade interfaces, and all the guerilla and photoshop stuff.


This is a must. You're probably the number 1 HUD guy around here; we need all the experts to make tutorials for their area of expertise. (For example, l238023 on Menus/widgets, Ifafudafi on particles, CAD on everything, ODX/ICEE/Teh Lag/Broke on animating, Gamma/BeachParty on crazy workarounds to get random things to work, etc)

EDIT: And yes I know some of these people have already done these things, I was just using them as examples.
Edited by SeanTheLawn on Oct 22, 2010 at 01:47 PM


Skidrow925
Joined: Mar 19, 2010

"ideological sense of respect and tact of a 5yo"


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 02:17 PM    Msg. 185 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: jesse
one day i'm going to make an extremely detailed tutorial on how to make HUDs. It will cover weapon interfaces, unit interfaces, grenade interfaces, and all the guerilla and photoshop stuff.


Think you could do it like sometime soon? I have been wondering how for a while...


SeanTheLawn
Joined: Sep 4, 2007


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 05:48 PM    Msg. 186 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: Sergeant Major
Quote: --- Original message by: SeanTheLawn

Quote: --- Original message by: jesse
one day i'm going to make an extremely detailed tutorial on how to make HUDs. It will cover weapon interfaces, unit interfaces, grenade interfaces, and all the guerilla and photoshop stuff.


This is a must. You're probably the number 1 HUD guy around here; we need all the experts to make tutorials for their area of expertise. (For example, l238023 on Menus/widgets, Ifafudafi on particles, CAD on everything, ODX/ICEE/Teh Lag/Broke on animating, Gamma/BeachParty on crazy workarounds to get random things to work, etc)

EDIT: And yes I know some of these people have already done these things, I was just using them as examples.
Edited by SeanTheLawn on Oct 22, 2010 at 01:47 PM


Sounds like a nice Talkshow. It seems like it would benefit all if a channel was put on youtube with tutorials...I know many people have tried and failed.


Well actually I just finished uploading all the Halomaps tutorials to a Youtube channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HaloVideoTutorials

Trying to figure out ways to make it easier to navigate though, since a lot of these tutorials are 4 parts or more.
Edited by SeanTheLawn on Oct 22, 2010 at 05:49 PM


Gamma927
Joined: Jun 12, 2008

Steam: gamma927


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 05:56 PM    Msg. 187 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: SeanTheLawn
Gamma on crazy workarounds to get random things to work

I do scripting and animating, not crazy workarounds >:[


SeanTheLawn
Joined: Sep 4, 2007


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 06:10 PM    Msg. 188 of 293       
Hey man, I was trying to think of something you did that I haven't seen anyone else do better. I remembered the Halo 2 marine weapon-switch thing you did and didn't know what to refer to it as. I thought of scripting but we have quite a few good scripters; you, Dwood, L0dex, etc. I didn't realize you were into animating though; my bad BRAH


Jesse
Joined: Jan 18, 2009

Discord: Holy Crust#4500


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 06:17 PM    Msg. 189 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: Gamma927
Quote: --- Original message by: SeanTheLawn
Gamma on crazy workarounds to get random things to work

I do scripting and animating, not crazy workarounds >:[


I do workarounds :D


d4rfnader
Joined: Jul 16, 2010

Open mouth, insert sandwhich.


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 06:25 PM    Msg. 190 of 293       
I'm not flaming bp or anything, but, what have they done?


SeanTheLawn
Joined: Sep 4, 2007


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 06:30 PM    Msg. 191 of 293       
Could've sworn BP had a few ways of making first-person legs.


Gamma927
Joined: Jun 12, 2008

Steam: gamma927


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 08:45 PM    Msg. 192 of 293       
You animate? k.

By the way, I quit ASP.


ODX
Joined: Jul 26, 2007

A rare sight, indeed.


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 11:05 PM    Msg. 193 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: ASP_GRUNTS
You aren't online enough to do anything as it is, you leaving has no impact on it.
Maybe not on "Gamma927" lololololol..


ODX
Joined: Jul 26, 2007

A rare sight, indeed.


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 11:11 PM    Msg. 194 of 293       
More than just that :P


ODX
Joined: Jul 26, 2007

A rare sight, indeed.


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 11:16 PM    Msg. 195 of 293       
Mainly in point because you don't show much off and there's no real motivation due to that too. Gamma is still somewhat active in CE though.


doompig444
Joined: Mar 22, 2010

MorniŽ alantiŽ


Posted: Oct 22, 2010 11:33 PM    Msg. 196 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: d4rfnader
I'm not flaming bp or anything, but, what have they done?


Spilled oil, destroyed ecosystems, placed animals on verge of extinction, etc etc etc.

Quote: --- Original message by: ASP_GRUNTS
I show my stuff to the team.


What team? I see no such thing.


Cocaine
Joined: Mar 2, 2009

Can't stop napping.


Posted: Oct 23, 2010 05:10 AM    Msg. 197 of 293       
Why you're losing more editors? Because there is a reduction in the current number and not enough new editors coming in.


d4rfnader
Joined: Jul 16, 2010

Open mouth, insert sandwhich.


Posted: Oct 23, 2010 12:17 PM    Msg. 198 of 293       
People will rip and copy reach and halo 3 for a little bit longer and then halo ce will go back to what it was originally intended for, CUSTOM CONTENT.


ODX
Joined: Jul 26, 2007

A rare sight, indeed.


Posted: Oct 23, 2010 01:28 PM    Msg. 199 of 293       
Severely doubted.


d4rfnader
Joined: Jul 16, 2010

Open mouth, insert sandwhich.


Posted: Oct 23, 2010 01:46 PM    Msg. 200 of 293       
I know lol, i just like to think that it might happen =P.


Hs_crozzhair
Joined: May 8, 2010


Posted: Oct 23, 2010 02:31 PM    Msg. 201 of 293       
Well when the older people find how to do something, they keep it secret, and get when a new person asks them how.


d4rfnader
Joined: Jul 16, 2010

Open mouth, insert sandwhich.


Posted: Oct 23, 2010 08:24 PM    Msg. 202 of 293       
Lol, let's try not to flame the older people =P


Dwood
Joined: Oct 23, 2007

Judge Ye Therefore


Posted: Oct 23, 2010 09:05 PM    Msg. 203 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: Hs_crozzhair
Well when the older people find how to do something, they keep it secret, and get when a new person asks them how.


Well if the newer people would learn how to do stuff on their own and use the tutorials given to them....


Skidrow925
Joined: Mar 19, 2010

"ideological sense of respect and tact of a 5yo"


Posted: Oct 23, 2010 10:45 PM    Msg. 204 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: doompig444
Quote: --- Original message by: d4rfnader
I'm not flaming bp or anything, but, what have they done?


Spilled oil, destroyed ecosystems, placed animals on verge of extinction, etc etc etc.

Quote: --- Original message by: ASP_GRUNTS
I show my stuff to the team.


What team? I see no such thing.


Not really. They sorta fixed it.

Same here.


doompig444
Joined: Mar 22, 2010

MorniŽ alantiŽ


Posted: Oct 23, 2010 10:56 PM    Msg. 205 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: ASP_GRUNTS
What brain? You have no such thing.


So I ask you again, Grunts. What team?


Maniac1000
-Helpful Poster-
Joined: Feb 24, 2007


Posted: Oct 25, 2010 11:33 AM    Msg. 206 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: Hs_crozzhair
Well when the older people find how to do something, they keep it secret, and get when a new person asks them how.


You are free to ask me anything, i will help if i can.


doompig444
Joined: Mar 22, 2010

MorniŽ alantiŽ


Posted: Oct 25, 2010 05:51 PM    Msg. 207 of 293       
New People:
How did the old people learn how to map? Trial and error, then asking specific, tantalizing questions when they emerged. It's not, "How do I even start adding a vehicle into Bloodgulch?" It's, "How do I in-game these custom vehicle animation?", with a nice video of the animations in Max. When people see you've taken a lot of time and effort into something and really need help, they'll gladly provide you with the knowledge. When you're asking for something that a simple search and three pages of tutorials already cover, no one will bother.

Old People:
Why not release stuff simply for the betterment of the community, regardless of who uses it? Even if 1000 non-English speaking rippers use your stuff and miscredit you, there's still the 100 people who instantly respect you as a talented, productive member.

Quote: As said by Jahran: This map is unprotected. Feel free to, but not limited to rip, reuse, render, fix, improve, remake, learn from, or re-release anything contained within this map. Just donít use it to gain profit in any way, shape or form without written permission. Also, it would be nice to credit me for anything you release containing my tags, and to keep what ever map using my tags unprotected as well so that others can learn from or benefit from them to help make a more productive and friendly development community.


Why can you not adopt a mindset like the one shown above?


Hs_crozzhair
Joined: May 8, 2010


Posted: Oct 25, 2010 06:00 PM    Msg. 208 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: doompig444
Quote: As said by Jahran: This map is unprotected. Feel free to, but not limited to rip, reuse, render, fix, improve, remake, learn from, or re-release anything contained within this map. Just donít use it to gain profit in any way, shape or form without written permission. Also, it would be nice to credit me for anything you release containing my tags, and to keep what ever map using my tags unprotected as well so that others can learn from or benefit from them to help make a more productive and friendly development community.


Why can you not adopt a mindset like the one shown above?

Becuase of some not-respected rippers on here.


DA_Ender
Joined: Oct 22, 2010

(–ń)Ä—–ňR ÜhÄ Gň—ō«Ō–D 


Posted: Oct 25, 2010 06:01 PM    Msg. 209 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: Hs_crozzhair
Well when the older people find how to do something, they keep it secret, and get when a new person asks them how.


I am the largest supporter of open source in CE and that includes knowledge too! I may not be a very good modeler, but I am more than happy to help/share my content with anyone, old or new, that asks. I am a mere PM away.


Gamma927
Joined: Jun 12, 2008

Steam: gamma927


Posted: Oct 25, 2010 06:48 PM    Msg. 210 of 293       
Quote: --- Original message by: doompig444
Why can you not adopt a mindset like the one shown above?

Protection is actually a catalyst for achieving knowledge. For instance, back in 07, if there was something really cool out there that you couldn't have, you either had to work to create something like it, furthering your knowledge in this regard, or work with the person who had it, creating a team. In either case, it would be beneficial to your character as a whole, as you'd have to learn how to make it.

Fast forward to today. You want it? Go rip it. No knowledge required. Now, let's say there's something you want to do. Don't know how to redirect a tag? Don't know how to ingame a model? That's ok, someone will always release something and you can always rip it. The fundamentals become lost, and people don't LEARN the most important aspects of map making. If they get a constant supply of other people's stuff, which obviously would be better than their own, they won't even put in any effort to MAKE their own stuff. They won't TRY. Through the past few months, I've only observed a handful of new members attempting to learn, practicing their modeling / scripting / animating to get better. A lot of other people ask me for the simplest things, and when they give up, they ask for the tags that they haven't tried making.

Don't get this rant wrong, and assume it's some bullcrap about how adversity is good, and that it's necessary, and no one should share. Adversity IS good and important, but the thing is, people are becoming lazier and lazier, and AVOIDING adversity at all. When faced with a difficult challenge, most people either take the easy way out (rip, after all, why put in the effort?) or quit (effort? pshhh, I'm out of here). What good would sharing do if people can't survive on their own? Would you donate your own blood to leeches out of the goodness of your heart? (For anyone who responds to that, that was rhetorical; be quiet).

TL;DR
-Not donating is important to convince people to learn. If they have no motivation to learn, once all the tag makers are gone, who's going to do it? Surely not them.
-With ripping made easy, no one has motivation to learn, and just rip stuff and use stuff from public releases.
-If we donate everything we made, they would get spoiled, and just expect stuff to flow to them. No point in learning if you're getting everything handed to you on a silver platter.
-Tag releases should be viewed as small bonuses, not as something that everyone's obligated to do.

 
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