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Author Topic: The Trinity Map Pack UPDATE (383 messages, Page 7 of 11)
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flyingpenguin117
Joined: Sep 8, 2010

You must Never, EVER leave a SINGLE BOB ALIVE!!!


Posted: Jan 12, 2011 10:50 PM    Msg. 211 of 383       
Quote: --- Original message by: qwertyuiop
Also, i heard tool pro makes maps randomly exception.


I heard it only does that if you have over 175 MB.


sierra117
Joined: Jan 10, 2008

If sex is good exercise, why are there fat sluts?


Posted: Jan 13, 2011 12:09 AM    Msg. 212 of 383       
it exceptions when the map reaches its tag limit, whether it compiled properly or not..


flyingpenguin117
Joined: Sep 8, 2010

You must Never, EVER leave a SINGLE BOB ALIVE!!!


Posted: Jan 13, 2011 06:20 PM    Msg. 213 of 383       
Quote: Other contributing people have asked be about tag protection for the Trinity maps and while I am still deciding (as I am personally against a closed source community), the map may be protected out of desire to respect other authors wishes. Therefore my own personal tagset may be released separately some time after the release of the maps.


flyingpenguin117
Joined: Sep 8, 2010

You must Never, EVER leave a SINGLE BOB ALIVE!!!


Posted: Jan 13, 2011 10:15 PM    Msg. 214 of 383       
?


DA_Ender
Joined: Oct 22, 2010

()R h GD


Posted: Jan 15, 2011 02:11 AM    Msg. 215 of 383       
Tool pro doesn't cause an exception if you are careful, atleast it hasn't in any of the 4vs4 beta testing we've done. Although I have hit a wall so if anyone has advice on whats making genocide crash please help me I don't know what else I can do.


DA_Ender
Joined: Oct 22, 2010

()R h GD


Posted: Jan 15, 2011 02:32 AM    Msg. 216 of 383       
Quote: --- Original message by: qwertyuiop
Quote: --- Original message by: MoooseGuy
Quote: --- Original message by: qwertyuiop
Quote: --- Original message by: qwertyuiop
isn't there a cracked version of hek or something that lets you have more vehicles?
lol. have you tried this?


If you're talking about kornman's HEK than yes I have it already and to my knowledge the maximum default vehicle number is 6.


Slap Happy
Joined: Feb 2, 2009

Life ain't fair, buy a helmet.


Posted: Jan 15, 2011 12:58 PM    Msg. 217 of 383       
Quote: --- Original message by: DA_Ender

Quote: --- Original message by: sierra117
completely remove the scripts & the extra vehicles. Compile.
if you dont get the error, just re-write the script & add the vehicles in.

& i mean RE-WRITE not just copy & paste. Iv had this problem before, except halo exceptioned on map load, not game load. :/
even if its exactly the same script. For some reason it would work if you didnt copy & paste. Not a clue why. But whatever..



It has absolutely nothing to do with the script. There is no scripts added to this map yet. The scripts are already written and work. But before I started populating I loaded up the palettes with everything I would need. The vehicles were simply added to the palette and it crashes unless theres only the six that are in the globals added to the palette. This applies even if all the other palettes (scenery, devices, ect) are empty as well. It's just the vehicles and only with this map.

Makes no sense.
Edited by DA_Ender on Jan 12, 2011 at 02:55 AM


"There is no scripts added to this map yet. The scripts are already written and work." So . . . you DO have scripts added to the map, even possibly compiled from a previous version? If so, remove them - just to eliminate the possibility.

From what you said "it crashes" you mean guerilla crashes or sapien?, you said as soon as you add more than six vehicles the pallete it crashes? I am guessing sapien crashes as you add a vehicle, this is normally written to debug (as you are aware), but not "always" if it happens when adding anything with an animation graph, such as vehicles. This normally means there is a negative value within an animation block or function block.

Add each vehicle 1 by one, meaning, add the vehicle, then place the vehicle in sapien so you can see it, then save, then add the next, then place the vehicle and continue doing this until you get the crash, and note which vehicle caused the crash - this would be your problem child. It is NOT because you have more than 6 vehicles, it IS because one of them has an error which is not being reported to debug, because you most likely added them all to the pallette first, without placing them one by one. Zipping or compressing animation graphs sometimes causes corruption to the tag and it ends up writing a negative value in a function block and ends up causing sapien to crash.

This can also happen when the collision of a vehicle doesn't like your collision geometry of your bsp, especially if there is a water/fog plane - this happened to me with Hillbilly Mudbog, later I discovered a bunch of phantom bsp errors. At first I thought it was the vehicle, so I placed in another map, and it worked fine, but when placed on that first version of Hillbilly, sapien would crash if I placed the vehicle in a specific region that had the error - but, no other vehicles collision had this error/problem/crash except "The Walton" which is why I made it scenery in the map, with smoke coming off it, lol (it had a redneck appeal) - it was easier than fixing phantom bsp errors.

If you had a previous, somewhat populated scenario, then changed the bsp, but did not remove other items, such as weapons, scenery, etc - then you updated the bsp, these items may now be below the bsp surface, or out of the map entirely, which can also cause a crash.
Edited by Slap Happy on Jan 15, 2011 at 01:03 PM


DA_Ender
Joined: Oct 22, 2010

()R h GD


Posted: Jan 17, 2011 10:28 PM    Msg. 218 of 383       
Quote: --- Original message by: Slap Happy

Quote: --- Original message by: DA_Ender

Quote: --- Original message by: sierra117
completely remove the scripts & the extra vehicles. Compile.
if you dont get the error, just re-write the script & add the vehicles in.

& i mean RE-WRITE not just copy & paste. Iv had this problem before, except halo exceptioned on map load, not game load. :/
even if its exactly the same script. For some reason it would work if you didnt copy & paste. Not a clue why. But whatever..



It has absolutely nothing to do with the script. There is no scripts added to this map yet. The scripts are already written and work. But before I started populating I loaded up the palettes with everything I would need. The vehicles were simply added to the palette and it crashes unless theres only the six that are in the globals added to the palette. This applies even if all the other palettes (scenery, devices, ect) are empty as well. It's just the vehicles and only with this map.

Makes no sense.
Edited by DA_Ender on Jan 12, 2011 at 02:55 AM


"There is no scripts added to this map yet. The scripts are already written and work." So . . . you DO have scripts added to the map, even possibly compiled from a previous version? If so, remove them - just to eliminate the possibility.

From what you said "it crashes" you mean guerilla crashes or sapien?, you said as soon as you add more than six vehicles the pallete it crashes? I am guessing sapien crashes as you add a vehicle, this is normally written to debug (as you are aware), but not "always" if it happens when adding anything with an animation graph, such as vehicles. This normally means there is a negative value within an animation block or function block.

Add each vehicle 1 by one, meaning, add the vehicle, then place the vehicle in sapien so you can see it, then save, then add the next, then place the vehicle and continue doing this until you get the crash, and note which vehicle caused the crash - this would be your problem child. It is NOT because you have more than 6 vehicles, it IS because one of them has an error which is not being reported to debug, because you most likely added them all to the pallette first, without placing them one by one. Zipping or compressing animation graphs sometimes causes corruption to the tag and it ends up writing a negative value in a function block and ends up causing sapien to crash.

This can also happen when the collision of a vehicle doesn't like your collision geometry of your bsp, especially if there is a water/fog plane - this happened to me with Hillbilly Mudbog, later I discovered a bunch of phantom bsp errors. At first I thought it was the vehicle, so I placed in another map, and it worked fine, but when placed on that first version of Hillbilly, sapien would crash if I placed the vehicle in a specific region that had the error - but, no other vehicles collision had this error/problem/crash except "The Walton" which is why I made it scenery in the map, with smoke coming off it, lol (it had a redneck appeal) - it was easier than fixing phantom bsp errors.

If you had a previous, somewhat populated scenario, then changed the bsp, but did not remove other items, such as weapons, scenery, etc - then you updated the bsp, these items may now be below the bsp surface, or out of the map entirely, which can also cause a crash.
Edited by Slap Happy on Jan 15, 2011 at 01:03 PM



All of the vehicles I use are also in Contamination. All 26 of them. I use the same globals file for contamination and genocide because they both have the same vehicles.
Sapien and Guerilla never crash. Both maps (genocide and contamination) build fine with all 26 vehicles placed in the map. (Scripts are prewritten but not compiled into the scenario upon building the map). I load contamination and spawn fine. I load genocide and BAM halo CE crashes before I even spawn. So I open Genocide.scenario and delete the vehicles one by one continueing to build the map and test (and crash) until its just the longsword, scarab, mjet, siren, and AA-Wraith (the 6 global vehicles for genocide and contamination). Only then will I spawn on genocide crash free.

It makes no sense. The two maps have the same content and same size bsps but one just refuses to work...


Xoronatus
Joined: Dec 6, 2010

Taking a break


Posted: Jan 18, 2011 01:17 AM    Msg. 219 of 383       
These maps will be unprotected like Extinction was right?


Volteer55
Joined: Jul 11, 2010


Posted: Jan 18, 2011 01:34 AM    Msg. 220 of 383       
i dont mean to be off-topic, but that just sounded greedy... (personally)
idk if anyone agrees, but ender is having troubles here, and you going on about protection... geez


Xoronatus
Joined: Dec 6, 2010

Taking a break


Posted: Jan 18, 2011 02:03 AM    Msg. 221 of 383       
Well, the tags look like a great addition to the community. After all since he has so many great tags in the maps. That right there is CUSTOM edition at it's finest


Slap Happy
Joined: Feb 2, 2009

Life ain't fair, buy a helmet.


Posted: Jan 18, 2011 02:43 AM    Msg. 222 of 383       
Back on topic . . .

Things to confirm for random or consistent crashes (guess work)

- Compile the map with default globals, if crash still happens, you have eliminated one possibility, if not, then you have confirmed the problem exists in the your globals and not in your scenario/bsp. (this is the fastest/easiest check)

-Check to ensure the FIRST (and all) player spawns on each team is above the bsp surface.

-Long sounds, sound scenery or background or music causes exceptions (break into 15-20 second permus) as well as wrong sampling for unit dialogues

-Ensure no mp player spawns are within trigger volumes used to spawn vehicles and other units/weapons which may kill the player before being teleported to the spawn flag

-Ensure that both teams have flag spawns for CTF, having 2 flags for team 0, red but no blue can cause exceptions on CTF gametype

-Ensure the gametype player spawns actually exist for the game type chosen in the lobby, or by default gametypes

-have someone else, on a different machine load the map. If they can, but you cannot, you may have a corrupted blam file in your gametype (detectable if empty string shows up when you create or edit a game type)

-if any of your scripts, or custom ui maps keypresses (keyboard) to the game (such as camera debug, flycam, fov), these can sometimes trigger firewall/virus false positives with virus scanners and violate Windows 7 system security settings (same thing happens with BitterBanana's FOV utility)

-tagset is too large - toolpro allows compiling, but causes crashes on some machines at map load (namely yours) - regardless of claims to the contrary

-If you have any hex edited/protected bitmaps such as hud/ui bitmaps, the bitmaps themselves may have incorrect editing, they just aren't being "read" = exception

- did you say you DID add more than 6 vehicles in the GLOBALS tag? I thought you could only add 6 in the globals, but many more in the scenario, then script spawn the vehicles in either, but only 6 would spawn by globals and nothing more. I have a friend who did 30 vehicles - I will ask and find out what issues he had (he doesn't forum much)

Good luck



Edited by Slap Happy on Jan 18, 2011 at 02:51 AM


DA_Ender
Joined: Oct 22, 2010

()R h GD


Posted: Jan 18, 2011 11:13 PM    Msg. 223 of 383       
Quote: --- Original message by: Slap Happy

Back on topic . . .

Things to confirm for random or consistent crashes (guess work)

Edited by Slap Happy on Jan 18, 2011 at 02:51 AM



Thanks for your comprehensive response Slap Happy, it's nice to see someone out there notices my S.O.S! :D

I have gone through your list, and while many of those things I already know to avoid doing I will underline what I have done/tried.

- Compile the map with default globals, if crash still happens, you have eliminated one possibility, if not, then you have confirmed the problem exists in the your globals and not in your scenario/bsp. (this is the fastest/easiest check)

- Check to ensure the FIRST (and all) player spawns on each team is above the bsp surface.


-Long sounds, sound scenery or background or music causes exceptions (break into 15-20 second permus) as well as wrong sampling for unit dialogues

This one made me think as I have a secret room that has a song that plays in the background. But still if I remove all vehicles from the palette in sapien, (except for the ones referenced in the globals tag) then build the map, I spawn fine. So it can't be this. I broke up the sound just incase but it made no difference


-Ensure no mp player spawns are within trigger volumes used to spawn vehicles and other units/weapons which may kill the player before being teleported to the spawn flag

-Ensure that both teams have flag spawns for CTF, having 2 flags for team 0, red but no blue can cause exceptions on CTF gametype


-Ensure the gametype player spawns actually exist for the game type chosen in the lobby, or by default gametypes

-have someone else, on a different machine load the map. If they can, but you cannot, you may have a corrupted blam file in your gametype (detectable if empty string shows up when you create or edit a game type)
I have three computers and all crash on map load in Halo CE.

-if any of your scripts, or custom ui maps keypresses (keyboard) to the game (such as camera debug, flycam, fov), these can sometimes trigger firewall/virus false positives with virus scanners and violate Windows 7 system security settings (same thing happens with BitterBanana's FOV utility)

-tagset is too large - toolpro allows compiling, but causes crashes on some machines at map load (namely yours) - regardless of claims to the contrary
The exact same tagset works on Contamination, and other large maps. The problem of it crashing on map load came around when the bsp got caves added to it. I redid the bsp from scratch and then added the structures from the old bsp and its now crashing the new bsp on map load.

-If you have any hex edited/protected bitmaps such as hud/ui bitmaps, the bitmaps themselves may have incorrect editing, they just aren't being "read" = exception
There are none

Thanks for your help slap happy, but none of this seems to want to work it only loads the map and spawns me if only the vehicles from the globals tag are loaded into the palette in sapien.

If you feel like discussing this matter further with me slap happy, I have xfire, msn, and AIM I would appreciate the help!


DarkHalo003
Joined: Mar 10, 2008

All ARs Need Green Little Buttons.


Posted: Jan 18, 2011 11:36 PM    Msg. 224 of 383       
Are you making new Scenarios and Lightmaps? Some tags like the scenario/ligtmaps/sky could be corrupt....what does your Debug say?


DA_Ender
Joined: Oct 22, 2010

()R h GD


Posted: Jan 19, 2011 02:36 AM    Msg. 225 of 383       
Quote: --- Original message by: DarkHalo003
Are you making new Scenarios and Lightmaps? Some tags like the scenario/ligtmaps/sky could be corrupt....what does your Debug say?


If you read earlier posts, you'll see that there is no record of the crash in the debug output. This is what is making this into guess work.


DarkHalo003
Joined: Mar 10, 2008

All ARs Need Green Little Buttons.


Posted: Jan 19, 2011 10:16 PM    Msg. 226 of 383       
Quote: --- Original message by: DA_Ender
Quote: --- Original message by: DarkHalo003
Are you making new Scenarios and Lightmaps? Some tags like the scenario/ligtmaps/sky could be corrupt....what does your Debug say?


If you read earlier posts, you'll see that there is no record of the crash in the debug output. This is what is making this into guess work.

Huh. That is very odd. But then again, considering it only exceptions in-game, it would make sense. I'll think of anything I can from when I used to heavily mod maps that exceptioned on me in-game. All I can implore is that you do the .scenario and lightmaps from scratch. Also make sure that anything exclusive to that map is removed first and see if that works.


Jaz
Joined: Mar 21, 2010

[Insert sarcastic comment here]


Posted: Jan 22, 2011 12:58 PM    Msg. 227 of 383       
Still making this map?


flyingpenguin117
Joined: Sep 8, 2010

You must Never, EVER leave a SINGLE BOB ALIVE!!!


Posted: Jan 22, 2011 08:36 PM    Msg. 228 of 383       
If Genocide doesn't kill him first.


Cocaine
Joined: Mar 2, 2009

Can't stop napping.


Posted: Jan 22, 2011 09:31 PM    Msg. 229 of 383       
I wish I could give you more than moral encouragement.


flyingpenguin117
Joined: Sep 8, 2010

You must Never, EVER leave a SINGLE BOB ALIVE!!!


Posted: Feb 4, 2011 08:17 AM    Msg. 230 of 383       
Quote: --- Original message by: flyingpenguin117
If Genocide doesn't kill him first.


I think it might have won...


Cocaine
Joined: Mar 2, 2009

Can't stop napping.


Posted: Feb 4, 2011 08:19 AM    Msg. 231 of 383       
Dare I ask the status of this project?


TLP_S_Hunter
Joined: Feb 4, 2011

Blaarg


Posted: Feb 4, 2011 09:59 PM    Msg. 232 of 383       
Haven't seen Ender on Xfire in some time. Hope he's alright... :/


Muscl3r
Joined: May 22, 2010

dont pray 4 easy lives...pray to be STRONGER MEN


Posted: Feb 5, 2011 02:54 AM    Msg. 233 of 383       
What happened? Did he die?


Amazingcuziam
Joined: Apr 16, 2010

Sup.


Posted: Feb 5, 2011 09:45 AM    Msg. 234 of 383       
Quote: --- Original message by: Muscl3r
What happened? Did he die?
Nope, judging by his facebook (yeah, i'm friends with him.) he was engaged on Wednesday (or a few days before) and so quite frankly i don't blame him for not being around. Hope i cleared that up.


Sergeant 1337
Joined: May 1, 2010

Do you even lift?


Posted: Feb 19, 2011 04:49 PM    Msg. 235 of 383       
is this dead or is Ender really busy? or is he having issues with it?


Xoronatus
Joined: Dec 6, 2010

Taking a break


Posted: Feb 20, 2011 12:24 AM    Msg. 236 of 383       
This map is going to be so awesome. I hope it gets released soon. Hey, you know, this map would be great for CE3!!!


flyingpenguin117
Joined: Sep 8, 2010

You must Never, EVER leave a SINGLE BOB ALIVE!!!


Posted: Feb 20, 2011 08:40 PM    Msg. 237 of 383       
Quote: --- Original message by: Sergeant 1337
is this dead or is Ender really busy? or is he having issues with it?

I personally hope its the former. Issues have delayed this for almost 2 months.
Edited by flyingpenguin117 on Feb 21, 2011 at 11:59 AM


ymt iz back
Joined: Jul 21, 2010

-gamer- -modder-


Posted: Feb 25, 2011 06:40 AM    Msg. 238 of 383       
cant wait for this map :)


flyingpenguin117
Joined: Sep 8, 2010

You must Never, EVER leave a SINGLE BOB ALIVE!!!


Posted: Feb 26, 2011 10:28 PM    Msg. 239 of 383       
I hope he at least releases the other two. What are we supposed to do while we're waiting for them? Go outside? HA HA HA!



No.


DA_Ender
Joined: Oct 22, 2010

()R h GD


Posted: Mar 18, 2011 09:54 PM    Msg. 240 of 383       
Quote: --- Original message by: Sergeant 1337
is this dead or is Ender really busy? or is he having issues with it?



Hey guys this is my first post in two months.

I assure you my project is not dead! Please don't lose faith :) Between my son turning two, becoming engaged, and building my 1986 Honda Prelude, working and college, things in the life of Ender are a crazy blur of activity. The Trinity Map Pack did come to a screeching halt considering the rate that things were being completed back in october through december, but I still find time here and there to poke away at it. Right now I have completed two of the three trinity maps.

Contamination, the large map has had all testing a polishing done and is ready for final testing.

Paradox, the small ctf based map is also complete and polished with only a little more balancing to be done.

Genocide, well lets just say through the course of the maps development, I have consumed over 40 liters of coffee, and spent many all nighters infront of my computer trying to make this thing work for you guys. I have now put over 250 hours into the exception error I've come across ingame and its safe to say this map isn't going anywhere unless I get some outside help. It's sad its come to this but I've done all I can and I can't seem to conquer this error without sacrificing playability of the map.

So please be patient with tired old me and I plead; if you have the skills and patience to try and move this project forward and would like to help me, please dont hesitate to get in contact with me I can use all the help I can get.

Thanks guys


ally
Joined: Jun 23, 2010

Aye Ready


Posted: Mar 18, 2011 09:58 PM    Msg. 241 of 383       
any detail you can explain about the exception error?


Sergeant 1337
Joined: May 1, 2010

Do you even lift?


Posted: Mar 19, 2011 04:32 PM    Msg. 242 of 383       
ya it would be cool to release those. But its all up to you Ender.


flyingpenguin117
Joined: Sep 8, 2010

You must Never, EVER leave a SINGLE BOB ALIVE!!!


Posted: Mar 21, 2011 11:32 PM    Msg. 243 of 383       
Quote: --- Original message by: idltp
wow these maps look great! i have an idea. can you release the finished maps and when you get genocide working, release that separately?

ps- sorry i can't help you with that problem though.


I was going to suggest the exact same thing. Genocide kind of seems like an amped up version of Contamination. The primary difference would be the chokepoints like the MAC station and the positioning of the flags. The core gameplay and tagsets are rather similar (obviously).


Ubergoober
Joined: Oct 11, 2010


Posted: Mar 24, 2011 07:32 AM    Msg. 244 of 383       
whats ur paypal? ill chip in for more coffeeeeeee


DieHard Bob
Joined: Dec 2, 2005

i rule


Posted: Mar 25, 2011 11:57 PM    Msg. 245 of 383       
Just curious.. Anyone know if Ender still uses xfire at all, and what his username is if he does?

I used to have him added back around '06, but that was a looong time ago, and I'm not sure if he still uses the same name/uses it at all.

 
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