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»Forums Index »Halo 2 Vista Forum (Bungie/Microsoft) »Halo 2 Vista Map Design / Technical »Multiple scenarios?

Author Topic: Multiple scenarios? (11 messages, Page 1 of 1)
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Shock120
Joined: Jun 12, 2009

Valve ftw


Posted: Mar 14, 2011 11:52 AM    Msg. 1 of 11       
I'd like to learn a few things about the scenario [scnr]

Is it possible to have 2 scenarios in one map file? (like technically possible, not currently possible)

Is it possible to have 2 mainmenu map slots pointing to the same map and load from the different scenario?

In the slot string it would go > scenario/blaba/external map name/internal scenario name ?

That's all. :)
Edited by Shock120 on Mar 14, 2011 at 11:52 AM
Edited by Shock120 on Mar 14, 2011 at 11:54 AM


Garanas
Joined: Nov 16, 2008


Posted: Mar 14, 2011 01:05 PM    Msg. 2 of 11       
I don't think you can have 2 scenarios on 1 bsp, but there is an option to have several bsp's on 1 scenario, I don't know if it works but,

open up the .scenario, and then there are 2 palettes:
Structure BSPS, and then New / Add
SCenario Cluster Data and then New / Add.

I have no clue if it works or not and how, but maybe it helps you.


Shock120
Joined: Jun 12, 2009

Valve ftw


Posted: Mar 14, 2011 04:33 PM    Msg. 3 of 11       
Quote: --- Original message by: Garanas
I don't think you can have 2 scenarios on 1 bsp, but there is an option to have several bsp's on 1 scenario, I don't know if it works but,

open up the .scenario, and then there are 2 palettes:
Structure BSPS, and then New / Add
SCenario Cluster Data and then New / Add.

I have no clue if it works or not and how, but maybe it helps you.
I think you misunderstood.

You've seen how in Halo Reach one map has multiple scenarios, for MP, Firefight and Campaign.


Kills_Alone
Joined: Jun 17, 2009

I ain't got no candy for you, NO CANDY


Posted: Mar 14, 2011 05:32 PM    Msg. 4 of 11       
I'd say the first poster answered the question pretty well.

Still, TwinReaper would be the one to ask. He may know more.


XlzQwerty1
Joined: Aug 6, 2009


Posted: Mar 14, 2011 05:32 PM    Msg. 5 of 11       
Then what is it that you want to do?


Twinreaper
Joined: Jun 5, 2010


Posted: Mar 15, 2011 02:32 AM    Msg. 6 of 11       
Someone called? Ahhh a scenario and bsp question...

Ok where to start with this one. First, I'll respond in order of Shock's question.

1. No. There is no way in the Halo 2 engine to reference multiple scenario files to a single or multiple bsp. Doing so would serve no purpose.

2. No...see answer #1.

As for the poster who responded first...he is semi-correct. You can infact build a map file with multiple bsp's and working switching to them in Sapien, but this in-game requires a small script to be executed in order for the game engine to off-load current bsp, and load the new bsp data. This is why any map file you play on has an isolated area in which the bsp switches. It's designed in a way so that the player doesn't see any missing map parts when the swap occurs. Imagine walking down a hallway and the next bsp loads. You walk a bit further and turn around...and see a giant skybox instead of level. Ugly right?

And as the first poster stated, there are many new reflexive chunks that must be added in order for the small script to work. By my count, there are 7 individual chunks that must be added in order to accomplish a bsp swap, and on top of that, you also have about 2 to 3 minimum of sub chunk data to include in each reflexive.

The main problem with the bsp switching isn't really the extra data you have to add to the tag, but rather getting any or all manually added "trigger volumes" to hold during map compiling. And yes, I did actually get these volumes to hold...but unfortunatly the compiler doesn't assign these volumes as "triggers"...but rather simple "death" volumes that have an absolute value of "0" for all cords, even though looking at them in an editor tells you otherwise.

And for the latter about Reach modes. There is no "multiple scenario" for the gametypes.
Each map has what was called back in the day, a "Mission Scene". This mission scene reflexives were tweaked to define what spawn points and blah...was loaded when a certain gametype was selected from the globals. Similar to how objects and scenery are loaded for certain bsp's. These new "scenes" however have a heavy size attachment, due to new seperate AI, pathfinding, obj, scen, etc palettes that it requires.

Furthermore, the multiplayer maps you play on, are not complete campaign maps. Yes, they do give you that impression at first glance when looking around the environment...but if you look close at how each multiplayer map was made....they picked parts of the campaign that were isolated by cliffs, bends or large structures. This was done to give the player the impression that the map was in fact, the entire level. If they were to do that, the multiplayer map size would likely dwarf the campaign size, given the amount of extra data to house a muliplayer map with such a wide variety of variant gameplay.

This is already way way way too long than I intended. I retreat back to my cold dark corner now.


Shock120
Joined: Jun 12, 2009

Valve ftw


Posted: Mar 15, 2011 11:50 AM    Msg. 7 of 11       
Oh, I don't mean BSPs xD

I mean, imagine there was a campaign map it had several bsps, and 1 scenario file.

I'd just like to know if I could duplicate the scenario file and apply modifications to it, and leave the original scenario alone.

And then, use the mainmenu to load from the same map but different scenario.

Just want to know the technicality, not the "is it possible now"
Edited by Shock120 on Mar 15, 2011 at 11:56 AM


Twinreaper
Joined: Jun 5, 2010


Posted: Mar 15, 2011 04:06 PM    Msg. 8 of 11       
As far as I know, from previos attempts.... You can duplicate the scenario file. But when you duplicate the scenario file, the game engine crashes due to pointers and offsets being largey off. Even if the raw data could be shifted properly, the game wngine would not recognize the second scenario file....and unfortunatly you would have no way to referrence it outside the map file itself. The best solution is to just build a different version of the map, and only use spawns for the exact gametype you want to soley support.


XlzQwerty1
Joined: Aug 6, 2009


Posted: Mar 15, 2011 04:08 PM    Msg. 9 of 11       
What the hell are you talking about?


Kills_Alone
Joined: Jun 17, 2009

I ain't got no candy for you, NO CANDY


Posted: Mar 15, 2011 06:56 PM    Msg. 10 of 11       
Yeah basically you would need to rely on one .scenario file that you set up 100%.

Then duplicate it, then make your changes to the new one. Then compile them as two separate maps.


Shock120
Joined: Jun 12, 2009

Valve ftw


Posted: Mar 16, 2011 08:53 AM    Msg. 11 of 11       
Quote: --- Original message by: XlzQwerty1
What the hell are you talking about?
Nothing to see here, move along.

Also, thanks Twinreaper. :)

 

 
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