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Author Topic: Pelican transporting vehicles through the atmosphere? (54 messages, Page 1 of 2)
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Hell_Jumper_056
Joined: Jan 7, 2010

Halo: Accession


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 06:10 PM    Msg. 1 of 54       
I was just wondering if the previous pelicans from halo 3 2 and 1 were able to transport vehicles though the atmosphere? In halo 1 there was never any known way to get a warthog to the ground without a pelican . If per say the Autumn didn't crash, it would've had to have its pelicans transport vehicles through the atmosphere since the Autumn was unable to sustain itself in the atmosphere unlike the frigate in halo 3 was. Also in halo 2, while the Frigate was in space over the halo ring, it deployed a pelican with a warthog.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PnkvuJBNIEw

Im guessing that vehciles can be transported through the atmosphere which i could also totally believe, seeing that its based in the future.

I did check the halo wiki, but it said nothing of the sort at all
Edited by Hell_Jumper_056 on Oct 23, 2012 at 06:11 PM


Dumb AI
Joined: Sep 18, 2011

Dead.


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 06:17 PM    Msg. 2 of 54       
Well,if you read Halo:The Flood,Foehammer and a group of pilots flew their Pelicans out of the PoA.
They must've entered the atmosphere,in order to land.
Also,in Halo 3,Pelicans were deployed near the Ark.It would be impossible to land on it without passing through the atmosphere.
Edited by Dumb AI on Oct 23, 2012 at 06:17 PM


Echo77
Joined: Jul 20, 2010

Humble thyself and hold thy tongue.


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 08:17 PM    Msg. 3 of 54       
I'm not sure, but seeing as how the Warthog lacks any form of heatshield, I'd say it probably wouldn't be able to withstand re-entry, realistically speaking.


renegade343
Joined: Jun 26, 2012

CE3 Stage Modeler, Editor, and Writer


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 08:25 PM    Msg. 4 of 54       
Maybe... Unless both the Pelican and 'Hogs use some futuristic, heat-resistant alloy that can withstand reentry.
Or Pelicans do some crazy maneuver in reentry where they turn upside-down, so the side towards
the passenger "pods" and cargo (Warthog) doesn't get heated up by air resistance?
(Yeah, that's really unlikely, but I can't think of any other ideas)


P3
Joined: Dec 2, 2011


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 08:31 PM    Msg. 5 of 54       
They made spartan armor that weighs tons of pounds and can withstand a fall from space, and yet they can't make a pelican or a warthog withstand reentry? Give it some kind of energy shield or something, jeez... >.>


SilentJacket
Joined: Jun 9, 2012

-Did I miss something?-


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 08:38 PM    Msg. 6 of 54       
I doubt warthogs would be fitted for drops higher than 50 meters, let alone atmospheric entry

Pelicans on the other hand are designated dropships (and the only one that I am aware of). It would make sense for them to incorporate heat shielding into the design.

All I can think of is that they incorporate MJOLNIR shielding into the cargo system to protect its payload. (which in realistic terms is horribly exposed, and would more than likely result in the cargo being damaged/destroyed before the vehicle landed.)


P3
Joined: Dec 2, 2011


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 08:40 PM    Msg. 7 of 54       
Use covie tech and use anti gravity on cargo area, or on the whole thing.


Dumb AI
Joined: Sep 18, 2011

Dead.


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 08:42 PM    Msg. 8 of 54       
Shielding is kind of rare in the UNSC.
I doubt they would use it for such a commonly used vehicle.
It's probably kind of like a space shuttle.It's probably armored with heat-resistant metal.
I think they practically use titanium for everything which is very resistant to heat.
Edited by Dumb AI on Oct 23, 2012 at 08:43 PM


SilentJacket
Joined: Jun 9, 2012

-Did I miss something?-


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 08:44 PM    Msg. 9 of 54       
what about the tires?

nah, even if they made the body out of titanium, rubber is still rubber.

like I said, most likely, they used some form of MJOLNIR shielding for the cargo, and standard Ceramics for the Dropship. Seeing as it also shuttles high explosives and weapons, personally, I think that the shielding would be a much more likely option
Edited by SilentJacket on Oct 23, 2012 at 08:46 PM


P3
Joined: Dec 2, 2011


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 08:48 PM    Msg. 10 of 54       
Covie tech, beaming it down by Scotty


Echo77
Joined: Jul 20, 2010

Humble thyself and hold thy tongue.


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 08:55 PM    Msg. 11 of 54       
Quote: --- Original message by: SilentJacket

what about the tires?

nah, even if they made the body out of titanium, rubber is still rubber.

like I said, most likely, they used some form of MJOLNIR shielding for the cargo, and standard Ceramics for the Dropship. Seeing as it also shuttles high explosives and weapons, personally, I think that the shielding would be a much more likely option
Edited by SilentJacket on Oct 23, 2012 at 08:46 PM


If the cargo was shielded, there'd be a visible flare when you fired a weapon at it. Odds are the vehicles aren't attached to the Pelicans until they're in-atmosphere, or the game designers simply overlooked that aspect for the sake of gameplay.


The Cereal Killer
Joined: Mar 18, 2011

Scripts, AI, cutscenes, ui_widgets, animation.


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 09:11 PM    Msg. 12 of 54       
Pelicans aren't the only UNSC dropships, you know. They could have used Albatrosses to bring vehicles down from space, which completely encase the vehicles in their cargo bays.

I've placed one in the hangar to demonstrate, and I put first a warthog and then a scorpion in it so you can see that it can carry either:









Looks like Vampgirl and I had the exact same thought simultaneously.
Edited by The Cereal Killer on Oct 23, 2012 at 09:11 PM


Dumb AI
Joined: Sep 18, 2011

Dead.


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 09:22 PM    Msg. 13 of 54       
OK,then.
Albatross dropships for vehicles.
Pelicans for living beings.


Hell_Jumper_056
Joined: Jan 7, 2010

Halo: Accession


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 10:33 PM    Msg. 14 of 54       
but as far as we know, the autumn had no albatross's (they would've had other options since the autumn wasn't supposed to crash lol), and im still thinking that P3's first comment made even more sense since the spartans can survive practically anywhere, so I bet that the vehicles can too.

and how can any of this be realistic in the first place lol? I just love the idea of orbital vehicles lol
Edited by Hell_Jumper_056 on Oct 23, 2012 at 10:35 PM


Dumb AI
Joined: Sep 18, 2011

Dead.


Posted: Oct 23, 2012 10:40 PM    Msg. 15 of 54       
Sigh.Let's pretend that the Pelicans are capable of reentering atmosphere and that all the Warthogs were retrieved from the PoA.
Halo takes place in the 26th century.Technology is much more advanced.
It's a sci-fi videogame.Doesn't have be as realistic as life.
Edited by Dumb AI on Oct 23, 2012 at 10:45 PM


Diaboy
Joined: Jan 24, 2011

A self-fulfilling prophecy of endless possibility


Posted: Oct 31, 2012 11:05 AM    Msg. 16 of 54       
Quote: --- Original message by: Dumb AI

Sigh.Let's pretend that the Pelicans are capable of reentering atmosphere and that all the Warthogs were retrieved from the PoA.
Halo takes place in the 26th century.Technology is much more advanced.
It's a sci-fi videogame.Doesn't have be as realistic as life.
Edited by Dumb AI on Oct 23, 2012 at 10:45 PM


True, but one important factor of any story is that it has to be believable. Which isn't not at all the same as realism, but the further away you go from reality, the more difficult it is to come up with a believable reason for making it work. Suspension of disbelief and all that.

As far as I am aware, we never actually see a warthog being transported from space, and through an atmosphere down to the ground, via a pelican, which I am sure probably means that they never intended for the warthog to be transported that way, story wise (I realise that there are situations where it is hinted at, but by not actually showing it it's never really addressed). Hence the existence of the Albatross, as mentioned by Cereal Killer and vampire.

Anyway, I guess the point I am making is I always kinda frown at the 'it's just a game' or 'its just a story' because if any game or story has people asking questions about believability, that is a flaw on behalf of those telling the story, and it's not a valid defence.
Edited by Diaboy on Oct 31, 2012 at 11:13 AM


Dumb AI
Joined: Sep 18, 2011

Dead.


Posted: Oct 31, 2012 11:12 AM    Msg. 17 of 54       
It's totally believable.Pelicans landed on Halo.PoA crashes on Halo.Marines take the Warthogs from the PoA to Alpha Base.Pelicans get Warthogs from there.


Diaboy
Joined: Jan 24, 2011

A self-fulfilling prophecy of endless possibility


Posted: Oct 31, 2012 11:15 AM    Msg. 18 of 54       
Quote: --- Original message by: Dumb AI
It's totally believable.Pelicans landed on Halo.PoA crashes on Halo.Marines take the Warthogs from the PoA to Alpha Base.Pelicans get Warthogs from there.


Sorry heh, I perhaps wasn't very clear - I was meaning the pelicans transporting warthogs from space unprotected. I didn't have a problem with the way the book dealt with things really, or that example :)


Dumb AI
Joined: Sep 18, 2011

Dead.


Posted: Oct 31, 2012 08:18 PM    Msg. 19 of 54       
Except during the time when the Chief gets Warthogs.He's rarely in any danger when Foehammer brings him Warthogs.


Dumb AI
Joined: Sep 18, 2011

Dead.


Posted: Oct 31, 2012 09:18 PM    Msg. 20 of 54       
And most lethal and lucky footsoldier on the entire Halo.


LegionofShadows
Joined: Jul 10, 2011

The Red Pill is strong in this one.


Posted: Nov 1, 2012 02:41 AM    Msg. 21 of 54       
And the universe.


OpsY
Joined: Feb 19, 2007

Frobisher Bay


Posted: Nov 1, 2012 08:06 PM    Msg. 22 of 54       
It's a question I've been wondering too. And let's face it: An albatross can carry what, 1 or 2 warthogs? It's totally ridiculous if it's ROLE is to carry freight to carry so few. In my maps i've envisioned two alternatives. The first 1 is almost a joke: a ODST pod sized up to carry vehicles. It does make sense tho if you want to support ODSTs that such a method could work.

The second method is the much bigger Beetle Dropship, with 16 ODST drop pods, a large cargo hold, a pelican bay (only 1 pelican) and living quarters for a full platoon. Fully VTOL designed the ship can send in ODSTs first and then land to serve as mobile command post. It also carries Warthog-droppods aforementioned .




This isn't canon. Just my own personal answer to those questions.


ELVEVERX
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

For the great journey


Posted: Nov 3, 2012 01:32 AM    Msg. 23 of 54       
Quote: --- Original message by: Tiel
Seems much more feasible to just use Frigates, which have all of the aforementioned features plus some.


The Cereal Killer
Joined: Mar 18, 2011

Scripts, AI, cutscenes, ui_widgets, animation.


Posted: Nov 4, 2012 03:01 PM    Msg. 24 of 54       
Quote: --- Original message by: Tiel
Seems much more feasible to just use Frigates, which have all of the aforementioned features plus some.
On one hand I might agree, especially seeing as in Halo 3 it is shown that the frigates have hangars with floors that can be lowered to deploy many infantry and vehicles; however, right before it lands at that part in H3, you hear one marine yell something like, "what? Can those land in-atmosphere!?" and another, "I guess we're gonna find out!"

But you have to ask yourself, if they weren't intended to land, why does the hangar do what it does for the vehicles and infantry? Very confusing indeed.


SilentJacket
Joined: Jun 9, 2012

-Did I miss something?-


Posted: Nov 4, 2012 03:21 PM    Msg. 25 of 54       
maybe they just neglected to read the frigate manual


master noob
Joined: Aug 10, 2012

343Industries Advocate


Posted: Nov 4, 2012 03:23 PM    Msg. 26 of 54       
Quote: --- Original message by: The Cereal Killer
But you have to ask yourself, if they weren't intended to land, why does the hangar do what it does for the vehicles and infantry? Very confusing indeed.


even frigates have to dock - what if frigates can park inside halcyon-class cruisers, ie the pillar of autumn? there's a thought.

in my mind, albatrosses are meant for fast and easy orbital deployment, seeing as landing a frigate is a long process and leaves a clear shot at taking it down.


ELVEVERX
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

For the great journey


Posted: Nov 4, 2012 09:21 PM    Msg. 27 of 54       
Quote: --- Original message by: The Cereal Killer
Quote: --- Original message by: Tiel
Seems much more feasible to just use Frigates, which have all of the aforementioned features plus some.
On one hand I might agree, especially seeing as in Halo 3 it is shown that the frigates have hangars with floors that can be lowered to deploy many infantry and vehicles; however, right before it lands at that part in H3, you hear one marine yell something like, "what? Can those land in-atmosphere!?" and another, "I guess we're gonna find out!"

But you have to ask yourself, if they weren't intended to land, why does the hangar do what it does for the vehicles and infantry? Very confusing indeed.

Maybe as dumb marines they had never seen one land because it was like there first mission and they were part of earths defense force meaning they wouldn't have much off world experience well some might but still only some are amazed


Dumb AI
Joined: Sep 18, 2011

Dead.


Posted: Nov 5, 2012 06:05 PM    Msg. 28 of 54       
Too bad titanium doesn't last long against plasma.


creator843
Joined: Jul 10, 2012

I LOVE HALO!


Posted: Nov 5, 2012 06:12 PM    Msg. 29 of 54       
Quote: --- Original message by: Dumb AI
Too bad titanium doesn't last long against plasma.
well they established colonies on several planets, should not have found some new kind of metal?


The Cereal Killer
Joined: Mar 18, 2011

Scripts, AI, cutscenes, ui_widgets, animation.


Posted: Nov 5, 2012 07:21 PM    Msg. 30 of 54       
Quote: --- Original message by: Tiel
Something also worth pointing out is that it seems that the guy whom ported the Albatross scaled it pretty oddly in the Custom Edition rendition.

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100302234903/halo/images/a/a0/CrashedAlbatross.jpg
My teammate ported it a long time ago and I'm just now putting it to use. We used the crashed one on Sandtrap in H3 as a reference - I think that size is about the same.


The Cereal Killer
Joined: Mar 18, 2011

Scripts, AI, cutscenes, ui_widgets, animation.


Posted: Nov 5, 2012 09:27 PM    Msg. 31 of 54       
Quote: --- Original message by: Tiel
...looks like larger vehicles can scarcely leave the CE version's compartment without some trouble.
Well with some scripts controlling its drop-off sequence, the one I'm using works well, and I'm sure that a larger version wouldn't change much. I understand how problems might arise in MP. It was ported with the sole intent of use in a campaign, though, so either way it won't cause issues.


master noob
Joined: Aug 10, 2012

343Industries Advocate


Posted: Nov 5, 2012 09:44 PM    Msg. 32 of 54       
Quote: --- Original message by: creator843
Quote: --- Original message by: Dumb AI
Too bad titanium doesn't last long against plasma.
well they established colonies on several planets, should not have found some new kind of metal?


to be scientific:

any metal after the already discovered metals on the periodic table can be estimated to be 1 or more of 3 things:
-liquid
-highly radioactive
-impure

so any other type of metal used or discovered would be an alloy, a compound, or a suicide trip.

to be blunt:

no.


Dumb AI
Joined: Sep 18, 2011

Dead.


Posted: Nov 5, 2012 09:46 PM    Msg. 33 of 54       
What about "artificial" metal?


master noob
Joined: Aug 10, 2012

343Industries Advocate


Posted: Nov 5, 2012 10:04 PM    Msg. 34 of 54       
Quote: --- Original message by: Dumb AI
What about "artificial" metal?

every metal past periodic number 88 is artificial, to my knowledge. unless you're thinking of an alloy.


Spartan314
Joined: Aug 21, 2010

Former biped rigger & FP animator


Posted: Nov 5, 2012 10:08 PM    Msg. 35 of 54       
Alloys maybe?

 
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