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Author Topic: Spotty Lightmap Generation (Please Help) H2PC (23 messages, Page 1 of 1)
Moderators: Dennis

The Spartan
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Aerial Dave


Posted: Oct 18, 2014 08:11 PM    Msg. 1 of 23       
I'm having trouble generating a lightmap with the Halo 2 Map editor - I'll just post some screenshots of the problem:









The lighting quality is set to Direct Only in these, and any higher setting has similar results. Checkerboard quality does work correctly.

I've tried another BSP, and it has the same results. I know I can just recompile the level without lighting to make it playable, but I obviously want to have a decent lightmap in the map eventually.

If anyone has any idea what the problem is, that'd be great.


Twinreaper
Joined: Jun 5, 2010


Posted: Oct 20, 2014 10:25 AM    Msg. 2 of 23       
At first glance my initial response would be, that something is occluding the lighting. More information would be great if you can provide it. Such as a quick pic of the actual environment in 3ds max, and what method you are using to run lighting. EX: Using tool command or the Map launcher shortcut.

Personally, I never get this type of lighting generation on anything myself. It could also be the bitmaps you are using. What usage are your bitmaps? DXT1, 2, 5?


The Spartan
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Aerial Dave


Posted: Oct 21, 2014 10:19 AM    Msg. 3 of 23       
Quote: --- Original message by: Twinreaper
At first glance my initial response would be, that something is occluding the lighting. More information would be great if you can provide it. Such as a quick pic of the actual environment in 3ds max, and what method you are using to run lighting. EX: Using tool command or the Map launcher shortcut.

Personally, I never get this type of lighting generation on anything myself. It could also be the bitmaps you are using. What usage are your bitmaps? DXT1, 2, 5?


I'm sure that there is nothing in the BSP occluding the lighting. I tried removing the player clipping bounderies, and tried a different BSP, with the same results. Also I am using the Map Editor launcher to start, which launches the tool command.

And what are DXT1, 2, and 5 bitmaps? I haven't touched the lightmap bitmap that Tool creates, unless you are talking about bitmaps for BSP shaders.

I remember seeing some lightmap generation options somewhere while using Guerrilla. I thought it was either the sky tag, BSP, or lightmap tag, but I can't find it now. It had options like minimum brightness for the lightmap, which could be relevant.

I appreciate any help.


Twinreaper
Joined: Jun 5, 2010


Posted: Oct 24, 2014 02:13 AM    Msg. 4 of 23       
Depending on the usage of the bitmap, you want to compile bitmaps in DXT3, 5 or 32 bit true color. DXT 3 is explicit alpha, DXT 5 is Interpolated and 32 bit true is the highest quality texture. I use 32 bit for all my map work except for when I need a good dingy plasma shader or other type of illum shader. Sometimes depending on the bitmap, you want to use DXt 3 o 5. Here's an example of real quick...


Here I used 32 Bit true color bitmaps for everything with a standard tex_bump_illum
shader

As you can see here I have a patchy fog tag as well as a planar fog. The only light sources for the map are 4 skylights with the +sky material and illumination coming from the illum tags

On Powerhouse, I have a different setting for each bitmap to create a gritty effect.

On the first 2 map shots for the H2MT map Corpsys, I have only run lighting on Draft_High so far and as you can see because of it, the bump maps show through pretty bad. On the last shot in the map Powerhouse, I had lighting ran on high, but did not specify any additional lum material prefixes to create darker sections inside.

If you like, you can send me the ass file or the max file and I can run it through it lighting to see what I get. I have every texture from halo 1 to 4 saved on my HEK so I don't need any bitmaps unless you created custom ones.

To me it looks as if the alpha channel is what is causing you issues with the lighting. The alpha channel depending on the usage, can occlude light.
Edited by Twinreaper on Oct 24, 2014 at 02:15 AM


The Spartan
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Aerial Dave


Posted: Oct 24, 2014 06:20 PM    Msg. 5 of 23       
Quote: --- Original message by: Twinreaper

Depending on the usage of the bitmap, you want to compile bitmaps in DXT3, 5 or 32 bit true color. DXT 3 is explicit alpha, DXT 5 is Interpolated and 32 bit true is the highest quality texture. I use 32 bit for all my map work except for when I need a good dingy plasma shader or other type of illum shader. Sometimes depending on the bitmap, you want to use DXt 3 o 5. Here's an example of real quick...

To me it looks as if the alpha channel is what is causing you issues with the lighting. The alpha channel depending on the usage, can occlude light.
Edited by Twinreaper on Oct 24, 2014 at 02:15 AM


Since the lighting is direct only, wouldn't it only occlude the shaders with odd alpha channels in the bitmaps? It even occludes the most basic flat_light_scratchyl bitmap, which has some larger surfaces in direct sunlight. I made another very simple test BSP with only a sky material and the flat_light_scratchy bitmap, and the lighting worked.

Nevertheless, I tried finding nearly every bitmap to every shader I used on this BSP and changed them to 32bit, and recompiled them. I got the same black BSP with light spots on every surface. I didn't change some water shaders, because I don't have to TIFFs to recompile them.

It has been a while since I have tried to get this to work, so I forgot about this error I get in tool while running the lightmap:
warn: can't determine sky index for surface XXXX

The values of XXXX seem to range from 5000 to 6999 and are in random order, so I'm not sure how many surfaces they really are. It shows that error for different surfaces as far as I can scroll up in command prompt.

If the problem is the bitmap format, what formats usually occlude lighting?

Thanks for the help though, it is just really difficult troubleshooting because lighting takes so long to generate. Also, are the www.halo2vista.com forums more active than these? Should I post it there to get more input?

Edited by The Spartan on Oct 24, 2014 at 06:26 PM


Twinreaper
Joined: Jun 5, 2010


Posted: Oct 25, 2014 01:00 AM    Msg. 6 of 23       
Unfortunately no, our forums are not very active and usually it's only me Kills, kantanamo or Scrapy that are active anymore on the map making scene.

Since your getting the sky index error, that means something isn't right with the material setup. Just to make sure, and I know this is a stupid question, but your using the +sky assignment for the material right? I'm including a quick pic of a sample material set from my corpsys map.



Also just so we're clear on another dumb question, you did re-compile the bitmaps directory after changing the bitmap attributes in Guerilla right?


The Spartan
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Aerial Dave


Posted: Oct 25, 2014 12:44 PM    Msg. 7 of 23       
Sky materials are set to +sky, and I recompiled the bitmaps I changed attributes. Some bitmaps I could not change the format, because I don't have the original TIFF to recompile.

To further the troubleshooting, this test BSP has only the flat_light_scratchy material applied:


I then changed every material in my BSP to flat_light_scratchy (except the sky obviously).

Before lightmaps with everything flat_light_scratchy:


Ater lightmaps with everything flat_light_scratchy (this time I did not get the "warn: can't determine sky index for surface XXXX" error):


The bitmap used in that shader material worked in the test bsp, but not this one. Therefore, it can't be the bitmap format causing the spotty lightmap, correct?

Here are some images of the BSP you asked for:






As you can see, the scenery geometry outside the BSP is quite large (and the material is set to lm:0.05 so it uses a smaller lightmap resolution), so my only guess is the sky would be too great of a distance to raytrace to the surfaces? But that doesn't explain the random spots of lights occurring.
Edited by The Spartan on Oct 25, 2014 at 12:46 PM


Twinreaper
Joined: Jun 5, 2010


Posted: Oct 26, 2014 01:46 AM    Msg. 8 of 23       
When you use the lm: addition to the material in 3dsmax, you are decreasing the amount of radiosity received to that material during lighting. A setting of 0.05 could be exactly why you are getting that spotty effect. When I used it to cover up the backsides of buildings in my Crater ODST map, I used a 0.01 setting and I did get some spotting. But for that it didn't matter since I was trying to cut down on resources. Try increasing the lm setting to 0.5 and see if that makes a difference.

Out of curiosity, why would you use the lm setting on an outside environment? Most of the time you only want to use lm to either give extra dark areas to inside portions of a map, or to decrease lighting time by zeroing out portions of the map you cannot see during gameplay.
Edited by Twinreaper on Oct 26, 2014 at 01:47 AM


The Spartan
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Aerial Dave


Posted: Dec 18, 2014 08:03 PM    Msg. 9 of 23       
Could intersecting geometry with the terrain cause this? Most of the level is polygon stitched with the terrain - but some of the rocks are supposed to be instanced geometry. Could this be the cause of this? And how do you properly set up instanced geometry in 3ds Max?

Thanks


Twinreaper
Joined: Jun 5, 2010


Posted: Dec 19, 2014 10:57 PM    Msg. 10 of 23       
You need to name instanced geometry with the prefix "%" and link it to the main level mesh. Your Tree should look like this in Max selection pane for exmaple...


b_levelroot
+portal
+portal_01
Example_Level
%instance_1
%instance_2


The Spartan
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Aerial Dave


Posted: Dec 20, 2014 02:43 PM    Msg. 11 of 23       
Well that's not the problem either, I ve tried it with only sealed world geometry, same stuff. After I watched the whole thing compile, I did spot these errors:






So, my only guess is that the BSP is too big? This is so frustrating, I even tried a fresh install of the H2 map editor.

Edit: fixed image link
Edited by The Spartan on Dec 20, 2014 at 02:44 PM


Twinreaper
Joined: Jun 5, 2010


Posted: Dec 21, 2014 06:11 PM    Msg. 12 of 23       
I've never seen that bitmap error before. As for sky index problems, that means you have faces that are not properly assigned the +sky material or a related error. The only way I can properly diagnose your errors is with the actual bitmaps and shader files, as well as the source max file. Troubleshooting these kinds of issues over a chat of any kind doesn't result in a good diagnosis. send me the files so i can have a proper look at them.


MEGA_VKNG
Joined: Dec 23, 2013

Now retired from CE, enjoy DW! https://goo.gl/1Bup


Posted: Jan 1, 2015 01:57 PM    Msg. 13 of 23       
Quote: --- Original message by: Twinreaper

Depending on the usage of the bitmap, you want to compile bitmaps in DXT3, 5 or 32 bit true color. DXT 3 is explicit alpha, DXT 5 is Interpolated and 32 bit true is the highest quality texture. I use 32 bit for all my map work except for when I need a good dingy plasma shader or other type of illum shader. Sometimes depending on the bitmap, you want to use DXt 3 o 5. Here's an example of real quick...

http://vyrantstudios.azurewebsites.net/Content/images/00006.jpg
Here I used 32 Bit true color bitmaps for everything with a standard tex_bump_illum
shader
http://vyrantstudios.azurewebsites.net/Content/images/00012.jpg
As you can see here I have a patchy fog tag as well as a planar fog. The only light sources for the map are 4 skylights with the +sky material and illumination coming from the illum tags
http://vyrantstudios.azurewebsites.net/Content/images/00017.jpg
On Powerhouse, I have a different setting for each bitmap to create a gritty effect.

On the first 2 map shots for the H2MT map Corpsys, I have only run lighting on Draft_High so far and as you can see because of it, the bump maps show through pretty bad. On the last shot in the map Powerhouse, I had lighting ran on high, but did not specify any additional lum material prefixes to create darker sections inside.

If you like, you can send me the ass file or the max file and I can run it through it lighting to see what I get. I have every texture from halo 1 to 4 saved on my HEK so I don't need any bitmaps unless you created custom ones.

To me it looks as if the alpha channel is what is causing you issues with the lighting. The alpha channel depending on the usage, can occlude light.
Edited by Twinreaper on Oct 24, 2014 at 02:15 AM


Sorry, i came here just for this, that looks awesome.


The Spartan
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Aerial Dave


Posted: Jan 13, 2015 10:47 AM    Msg. 14 of 23       
Could you send me the default coagulation.sky tag (or any other working sky)? Also, do you have this missing lens flare?:


I've tried test levels with only the metal_light_scratchy material, and the same spotty effect is happening, so it can't be the bitmaps.

Other than the sky tags, what other tags deal with the ray tracing process?


Kayak 001
Joined: Dec 30, 2014

Halo 3 for life!


Posted: Jan 13, 2015 09:13 PM    Msg. 15 of 23       
First of all, I'm getting a new PC! I want those shaders and stuff! Is that with the map, or is it a separate program or file or whatever it is for that high poly Halo 4 BR!

I NEED IT!!!


The Spartan
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Aerial Dave


Posted: Jan 14, 2015 12:36 AM    Msg. 16 of 23       
And sometimes this happens after adjusting the lm:x option for the materials on larger geometry:











Looks like I'm going to have to upload the map in it's non-glorified state. :(
Edited by The Spartan on Jan 14, 2015 at 12:37 AM


Kayak 001
Joined: Dec 30, 2014

Halo 3 for life!


Posted: Jan 14, 2015 12:46 AM    Msg. 17 of 23       
Quote: --- Original message by: Twinreaper

Depending on the usage of the bitmap, you want to compile bitmaps in DXT3, 5 or 32 bit true color. DXT 3 is explicit alpha, DXT 5 is Interpolated and 32 bit true is the highest quality texture. I use 32 bit for all my map work except for when I need a good dingy plasma shader or other type of illum shader. Sometimes depending on the bitmap, you want to use DXt 3 o 5. Here's an example of real quick...

http://vyrantstudios.azurewebsites.net/Content/images/00006.jpg
Here I used 32 Bit true color bitmaps for everything with a standard tex_bump_illum
shader
http://vyrantstudios.azurewebsites.net/Content/images/00012.jpg
As you can see here I have a patchy fog tag as well as a planar fog. The only light sources for the map are 4 skylights with the +sky material and illumination coming from the illum tags
http://vyrantstudios.azurewebsites.net/Content/images/00017.jpg

On Powerhouse, I have a different setting for each bitmap to create a gritty effect.

On the first 2 map shots for the H2MT map Corpsys, I have only run lighting on Draft_High so far and as you can see because of it, the bump maps show through pretty bad. On the last shot in the map Powerhouse, I had lighting ran on high, but did not specify any additional lum material prefixes to create darker sections inside.

If you like, you can send me the ass file or the max file and I can run it through it lighting to see what I get. I have every texture from halo 1 to 4 saved on my HEK so I don't need any bitmaps unless you created custom ones.

To me it looks as if the alpha channel is what is causing you issues with the lighting. The alpha channel depending on the usage, can occlude light.
Edited by Twinreaper on Oct 24, 2014 at 02:15 AM


HOW?! I NEED DIS STUFF! My new PC is coming soon! *Desperation intensifies*
Edited by Kayak 001 on Jan 14, 2015 at 12:47 AM
Edited by Kayak 001 on Jan 14, 2015 at 12:47 AM


MEGA_VKNG
Joined: Dec 23, 2013

Now retired from CE, enjoy DW! https://goo.gl/1Bup


Posted: Jan 14, 2015 03:41 PM    Msg. 18 of 23       
This stuff is for H2V if you look around hard enough I released a h4 br with h2 animations for halo ce.


Super Flanker
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

The length of your life depends on my aim.


Posted: Jan 17, 2015 07:59 AM    Msg. 19 of 23       
This is H2 not HCE. Nobody mods H2 anymore because it's locked down tighter than fort knox.

But those who do try to keep the h2v community alive are awesome.


Twinreaper
Joined: Jun 5, 2010


Posted: Jan 17, 2015 09:48 AM    Msg. 20 of 23       
I would be more than happy to share the weapon tags I created for Reach/Halo 4, as well as anything else that might interest you.

I do have that missing earthcity.lens_flare, as well as a multitude of missing tags found in red throughout the HEK. I'll rar up a complete tagged default sky for you and post it up.

Here is the rar archive for Coagulation's Sky. Just extract the contents to tags\scenarios\skies\multi\halo

http://vyrantstudios.azurewebsites.net/Content/coagulation_sky.rar


Here is the tag for the Storm_Battle_Rifle from Halo 4. There are two skins for this weapon. You will have to create the equipment tag to spawn it though. Skin can be changed by going into the storm_br shader and changing the bitmap. Bitmaps are included. Extract the contents to tags\objects\weapons\rifle

http://vyrantstudios.azurewebsites.net/Content/storm_br.rar
Edited by Twinreaper on Jan 17, 2015 at 11:04 AM


The Spartan
Joined: Feb 22, 2007

Aerial Dave


Posted: Feb 27, 2015 07:01 PM    Msg. 21 of 23       
I created a script to export from Blender (which spead up the troubleshooting), and finally got the lightmaps to look decent.

I uploaded the map on halomaps and was going to send you the files once Dennis published it. But after one month, 3 PMs to Dennis with no response, and 2 attempts to upload it, I assume he no longer publishes H2V maps :(


Super Flanker
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

The length of your life depends on my aim.


Posted: Feb 28, 2015 07:52 AM    Msg. 22 of 23       
Mediafire it here then?


Twinreaper
Joined: Jun 5, 2010


Posted: Feb 28, 2015 03:10 PM    Msg. 23 of 23       
Yeah Dennis hasn't published any H2V Map Submissions in a year now. I gave up and post them elsewhere since he and the site isn't generally interested.

As for exporting, were you using Blender the entire time or 3dsMax? The exported .ass file isn't whats causing the spotted light mapping. I had a similar issue a week ago with a new map I was making, and the spotted lighting I was getting was due to a combination of alpha channels and edited sky tag. Portals can also cause issues with lighting.

 

 
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