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Author Topic: B30_Evolved Multiplayer? (34 messages, Page 1 of 1)
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Perla117
Joined: Nov 10, 2014

The Last Italian On This Forum


Posted: Sep 3, 2015 02:39 PM    Msg. 1 of 34       
Hi everyone,
i started to learn how to make maps like 4 month ago...im not so good in modelling and i dont have so much time to spend on this.
TSC:E is the best level for halo ce that i ever seen, in my opinion, so i decide to combine two bsp(b30r_ext_lz-capp and b30r_ext_capp-cart 16) and make a multiplayer map.
many of you will not like this thing because I did not create a new map, but I have limited myself to get something that others have done....(CMT)
I thinks that to improve this game, is not only necessary to be good with HEK and 3ds but also have good ideas.
I honestly dont know if the work that I did was a waste of time.
I say this because I have noticed that the 2 bsp has a lot of polygons (90000)circa
Coldsnap has 54000 poly.
Hek tutorial recommends 10000 for a multiplayer map so I do not know if they really work.
however, these are the images of the two bsp:

RED BASE:
http://i.imgur.com/QTPo9TG.png
http://i.imgur.com/o4PcbqW.png

BLUE BASE:
http://i.imgur.com/ZTxEHEn.png
http://i.imgur.com/MIFcQza.png

http://i.imgur.com/tzU71jm.png

The radiosity is set to 0 for now, only to do debug lightmaps.

in these images you can see that there are holes ...
Fortunately you only see in two points of the map and do not give much trouble ...
I wanted to ask if this problem is caused by too many polygons or by wrong portals.

http://i.imgur.com/94Agv5F.png
http://i.imgur.com/9IN8wlZ.png

while compiling the map I have many errors on the portals
for now I only have portals of the first BSP and the less important of the second.
I should find a way to insert the most important portal of the second bsp (entry to the cartographer)
but every time I try, it fails during compilation.
there someone who can help me? always if the map can work in multiplayer ...

this is what tool says:

C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Games\Halo Custom Edition>os_tool.exe structure
cmt\scenarios\singleplayer\b30_revamp\newbsp2 b30r_ext_lz-capp
building intermediate geometry...
### WARNING found #5 degenerate triangles.
building collision geometry...
reducing collision geometry...
building collision bsp...
### WARNING found nearly coplanar surfaces (red and green).
reducing collision bsp...
verifying collision geometry...
verifying collision bsp...
building portals...
### WARNING: portal outside the bsp. [see magenta in error geometry]
### ERROR: portal does not define two closed spaces. (see yellow in error geomet
ry)

building render geometry...
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
### WARNING: a surface clipped to no leaves (see cyan in error geometry).
building subclusters...
building pvs... building pvs... building structure lens flares...done


structure bsp "cmt\scenarios\singleplayer\b30_revamp\newbsp2\b30r_ext_lz-capp"
BSP has 98308 nodes, 53336 leaves
72952 surfaces and 93211 vertices in 90 material groups
312 portals, 88 clusters

5779Kb collision data (438Kb vertices, 1687Kb edges, 513Kb surfaces)
7268Kb render data (3713Kb vertices, 1681Kb surfaces,
1409Kb nodes/leaves, 440Kb clusters)
0Kb pathfinding data
----------------------
14254Kb (without debug information)

Error When i tried to insert the portal of the second bsp (entry to the cartographer structure):

tried to add more elements for a structure_bsp_cluster_portal_index_block @09DF2
E74 #128 than allowed


This is all for now
greetings from Italy.
Edited by Perla117 on Sep 3, 2015 at 02:40 PM
Edited by Perla117 on Sep 3, 2015 at 02:41 PM
Edited by Perla117 on Sep 3, 2015 at 03:37 PM
Edited by Perla117 on Sep 3, 2015 at 03:44 PM
Edited by Perla117 on Sep 3, 2015 at 03:48 PM


Grunter
Joined: Apr 6, 2015

I'm back from the dead and reporting for duty!


Posted: Sep 3, 2015 03:03 PM    Msg. 2 of 34       
Cool, it would be a great map for a pelican for each team.


Kinnet
Joined: Dec 27, 2013

FeelsGoodMan


Posted: Sep 3, 2015 05:35 PM    Msg. 3 of 34       
is like deathisland:evolved
Edited by Kinnet on Sep 3, 2015 at 05:36 PM


Grunter
Joined: Apr 6, 2015

I'm back from the dead and reporting for duty!


Posted: Sep 4, 2015 05:24 AM    Msg. 4 of 34       
What tags are gonna be used? Stock SPV3 tags?


Perla117
Joined: Nov 10, 2014

The Last Italian On This Forum


Posted: Sep 4, 2015 07:05 AM    Msg. 5 of 34       
yes.. spv3 tags core release.( weapons, hud, ecc)
i need i nice scorpion tag...

im not sure to adding the pellican...


Spartan314
Joined: Aug 21, 2010

Former biped rigger & FP animator


Posted: Sep 4, 2015 07:27 AM    Msg. 6 of 34       
.jpg for future image references please
E: I'm pretty sure Slashrat (I think it was) had many issues on the portal side of things that he had to cast hocus pocus on to make it work as well as it did in TSC:E, so I'd guess that it'd be that.
Edited by Spartan314 on Sep 4, 2015 at 07:54 AM


pablolinkone
Joined: Feb 15, 2015


Posted: Sep 4, 2015 09:53 AM    Msg. 7 of 34       
a spv3 pellican looks cool for this map

with the help of kirby or altis or someone who knows about vehicles tags and collision


Super Flanker
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

The length of your life depends on my aim.


Posted: Sep 4, 2015 09:57 AM    Msg. 8 of 34       
1. You have adjusted the level mesh in such a way that the portals are unable to do their job correctly.

Best case scenario you may have to move a few vertices and edges around on the portal meshes specifically.

Worst case scenario you are going to have to do re-do all or nearly most of all the portals in the map which in your case would be classified as a mission: impossible.

2. A muliplayer environment shouldn't really exceed 45,000 triangles. Cold snap is the exception since It never really used that much scenery geo. Which was not the case for bigass which I think used under 31,000 triangles because it also used alot of scenery models.

That being said it really does depend on the design of the level it'self. Halo can't really cope with constant detail in every single portion of the map but if the detail is spread out into certain portions and they you also take measures to portal those portions correctly then sure you should be able to compile a map which exceeds the age old limit set by gearbox.
Edited by SS Flanker on Sep 4, 2015 at 10:01 AM


Perla117
Joined: Nov 10, 2014

The Last Italian On This Forum


Posted: Sep 7, 2015 11:35 AM    Msg. 9 of 34       
thanks guys for the answers....

another question:

is possible to play a yelo map in multiplayer? with a Sap Server?

I noticed that normal tool let me compile a .map file only if is under 130MB
so I can not put too many scenary object.....

i have to create a .yelo map if i want to add more scenary object in my map.

maybe i do something wrong.....

total tag size is 22.93M (0.07M free) with normal tool

total tag size is 7.92M (26.58M free) with os tool

WHY??

Thanks


Super Flanker
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

The length of your life depends on my aim.


Posted: Sep 7, 2015 04:54 PM    Msg. 10 of 34       
Quote: --- Original message by: Perla117
thanks guys for the answers....

another question:

is possible to play a yelo map in multiplayer? with a Sap Server?

I noticed that normal tool let me compile a .map file only if is under 130MB
so I can not put too many scenary object.....

i have to create a .yelo map if i want to add more scenary object in my map.

maybe i do something wrong.....

total tag size is 22.93M (0.07M free) with normal tool

total tag size is 7.92M (26.58M free) with os tool

WHY??

Thanks


Os surpasses tag space limits so you could theoretically build a map at any size.

Yelo maps can be integrated using sapp but isnt all that too common seeing as even of hac2 can donwload maps and install them for you it cant physically do the same for Os it self.


Perla117
Joined: Nov 10, 2014

The Last Italian On This Forum


Posted: Sep 8, 2015 03:56 AM    Msg. 11 of 34       
Quote: --- Original message by: SS Flanker

Os surpasses tag space limits so you could theoretically build a map at any size.

Yelo maps can be integrated using sapp but isnt all that too common seeing as even of hac2 can donwload maps and install them for you it cant physically do the same for Os it self.


i dont understand this...

total tag size is 22.93M (0.07M free) with normal tool
total tag size is 7.92M (26.58M free) with os tool

i put the same tags.. (only a few trees)..
why with os i have so much free tag space?and with the normal tool i have only 0.07 MB free?

thanks


Corpen
Joined: Aug 11, 2015

Sierra 612 - DIAC - "Why are we here?"


Posted: Sep 8, 2015 04:06 AM    Msg. 12 of 34       
Quote: --- Original message by: Perla117
Quote: --- Original message by: SS Flanker

Os surpasses tag space limits so you could theoretically build a map at any size.

Yelo maps can be integrated using sapp but isnt all that too common seeing as even of hac2 can donwload maps and install them for you it cant physically do the same for Os it self.


i dont understand this...

total tag size is 22.93M (0.07M free) with normal tool
total tag size is 7.92M (26.58M free) with os tool

i put the same tags.. (only a few trees)..
why with os i have so much free tag space?and with the normal tool i have only 0.07 MB free?

thanks


Os allows you to have more tags as it increases the amount that can be stored as it uses the .yelo to store them not .map as it uses memory hacks and stuff, thats if you use external though. It also compresses them more thats one thing i found when making my map.
Edited by Corpen on Sep 8, 2015 at 04:07 AM
Edited by Corpen on Sep 8, 2015 at 04:08 AM


Perla117
Joined: Nov 10, 2014

The Last Italian On This Forum


Posted: Sep 24, 2015 10:26 AM    Msg. 13 of 34       


EmmanuelCD
Joined: Jan 7, 2015

End my suffering


Posted: Sep 24, 2015 01:51 PM    Msg. 14 of 34       
Tour map looks fine


Perla117
Joined: Nov 10, 2014

The Last Italian On This Forum


Posted: Sep 24, 2015 02:44 PM    Msg. 15 of 34       
Quote: --- Original message by: EmmanuelCD
Tour map looks fine



thanks.. i hope to play this map online one day...

unfortunately, i have some problems with portals.. any help would be appreciated.


EmmanuelCD
Joined: Jan 7, 2015

End my suffering


Posted: Sep 24, 2015 08:35 PM    Msg. 16 of 34       
To add portals you need to make planes and asign the "+portal" material. They must pass the level BSP and be vertical


Perla117
Joined: Nov 10, 2014

The Last Italian On This Forum


Posted: Sep 25, 2015 02:38 AM    Msg. 17 of 34       
Quote: --- Original message by: EmmanuelCD
To add portals you need to make planes and asign the "+portal" material. They must pass the level BSP and be vertical



i know this, but i use the CMT portal of b30:E of the lz bsp for now...
i need to connect the portal of the second bsp with the first one..
otherwise i have bad performance with vsync and holes in some point of the map.


Masters1337
Joined: Mar 5, 2006

halonaminator's unfortunate idol


Posted: Sep 25, 2015 03:38 AM    Msg. 18 of 34       
The BSPs were highly manipulated to even get them to work in the release, trying to combine them is likely to end in disaster for you. When the map was being made there was no real budget set aside or even fully known for what they wanted to do. It was more of a process of block out an area, get it working, work on high poly version on par with H3 for several weeks, put it in all at the end. It's also the reason you'll notice the BSP switches are in bizarre places compared to other maps in the franchise.

If you do want to get multiple BSPs working in a single area, I'd suggest toning down a lot of their detail and bring it down to something expected from the engine.


Perla117
Joined: Nov 10, 2014

The Last Italian On This Forum


Posted: Sep 25, 2015 04:36 AM    Msg. 19 of 34       
Quote: --- Original message by: Masters1337
The BSPs were highly manipulated to even get them to work in the release, trying to combine them is likely to end in disaster for you. When the map was being made there was no real budget set aside or even fully known for what they wanted to do. It was more of a process of block out an area, get it working, work on high poly version on par with H3 for several weeks, put it in all at the end. It's also the reason you'll notice the BSP switches are in bizarre places compared to other maps in the franchise.

If you do want to get multiple BSPs working in a single area, I'd suggest toning down a lot of their detail and bring it down to something expected from the engine.


thanks for the replay masters..

You mean that i have to decrease the poly of the map or decrease the resolution of the bitmaps?

thanks


Masters1337
Joined: Mar 5, 2006

halonaminator's unfortunate idol


Posted: Sep 25, 2015 09:16 AM    Msg. 20 of 34       
Just how high poly the map is, I've basically learned you can rape ce with textures and the game will still keep on kicking.


Perla117
Joined: Nov 10, 2014

The Last Italian On This Forum


Posted: Sep 30, 2015 08:33 AM    Msg. 21 of 34       
Update:

fix the portals... working on the scenario part with sapien and test the map with final radiosity...


lolslayer
Joined: Mar 21, 2015

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMHbAKvPJkU


Posted: Sep 30, 2015 11:30 AM    Msg. 22 of 34       
Quote: --- Original message by: Masters1337
Just how high poly the map is, I've basically learned you can rape ce with textures and the game will still keep on kicking.


y low res textures on spv3 then? :P


Masters1337
Joined: Mar 5, 2006

halonaminator's unfortunate idol


Posted: Sep 30, 2015 11:43 AM    Msg. 23 of 34       
Pretty much everything in FP for SPV3 is 2048 or 1024, third person assets use 512 or 1024, depending on what tier they are designated.


lolslayer
Joined: Mar 21, 2015

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMHbAKvPJkU


Posted: Sep 30, 2015 03:34 PM    Msg. 24 of 34       
Quote: --- Original message by: Masters1337
Pretty much everything in FP for SPV3 is 2048 or 1024, third person assets use 512 or 1024, depending on what tier they are designated.


It was just a joke ;)


EmmanuelCD
Joined: Jan 7, 2015

End my suffering


Posted: Oct 1, 2015 08:51 AM    Msg. 25 of 34       
Are you going to release?


Perla117
Joined: Nov 10, 2014

The Last Italian On This Forum


Posted: Oct 1, 2015 03:25 PM    Msg. 26 of 34       
Quote: --- Original message by: EmmanuelCD
Are you going to release?



I have some things to finish before i can release...

1.put all the scenary object... sounds, devices, scenary(50%), net flag, fog, weapons, vehicles ecc..
2.I have to put a death barrier when you fall of the island and in the cave (dont know how to do it)
3.Change HUD (dont know how to do it)
4.Insert the cmt weapons and vehicles non OS version(I bealive that there was a thread some time ago but the link dosent work) because with the normal evolved_h1-spirit i have truble... (dont know how to do it)
5. finial radiosity.
6. test the map and look if the performance are good.


EmmanuelCD
Joined: Jan 7, 2015

End my suffering


Posted: Oct 1, 2015 07:07 PM    Msg. 27 of 34       
Quote: --- Original message by: Perla117
Quote: --- Original message by: EmmanuelCD
Are you going to release?



I have some things to finish before i can release...

2.I have to put a death barrier when you fall of the island and in the cave (dont know how to do it)


You can use trigger volumens and use them to kill player, but im not sure how it works on MP, i asked what things can be sync but i only obtained little info about that


Ki11erFTW
Joined: Jul 4, 2009

You've seen nothing yet.


Posted: Oct 1, 2015 07:13 PM    Msg. 28 of 34       
Quote: --- Original message by: Masters1337
The BSPs were highly manipulated to even get them to work in the release, trying to combine them is likely to end in disaster for you. When the map was being made there was no real budget set aside or even fully known for what they wanted to do. It was more of a process of block out an area, get it working, work on high poly version on par with H3 for several weeks, put it in all at the end. It's also the reason you'll notice the BSP switches are in bizarre places compared to other maps in the franchise.

If you do want to get multiple BSPs working in a single area, I'd suggest toning down a lot of their detail and bring it down to something expected from the engine.


Which is surprising since the map really looks no different compared to a standard Halo 1 map.


Masters1337
Joined: Mar 5, 2006

halonaminator's unfortunate idol


Posted: Oct 3, 2015 01:31 AM    Msg. 29 of 34       
Quote: --- Original message by: Ki11erFTW
Quote: --- Original message by: Masters1337
The BSPs were highly manipulated to even get them to work in the release, trying to combine them is likely to end in disaster for you. When the map was being made there was no real budget set aside or even fully known for what they wanted to do. It was more of a process of block out an area, get it working, work on high poly version on par with H3 for several weeks, put it in all at the end. It's also the reason you'll notice the BSP switches are in bizarre places compared to other maps in the franchise.

If you do want to get multiple BSPs working in a single area, I'd suggest toning down a lot of their detail and bring it down to something expected from the engine.


Which is surprising since the map really looks no different compared to a standard Halo 1 map.

Well the interiors do. But that's not really where the problems were.


Perla117
Joined: Nov 10, 2014

The Last Italian On This Forum


Posted: Oct 6, 2015 09:26 AM    Msg. 30 of 34       


EmmanuelCD
Joined: Jan 7, 2015

End my suffering


Posted: Oct 6, 2015 12:22 PM    Msg. 31 of 34       
Can you post a view from the beach with the water?


Perla117
Joined: Nov 10, 2014

The Last Italian On This Forum


Posted: Oct 6, 2015 12:51 PM    Msg. 32 of 34       


EmmanuelCD
Joined: Jan 7, 2015

End my suffering


Posted: Oct 6, 2015 01:48 PM    Msg. 33 of 34       
Quote: --- Original message by: Perla117
here they are..







Looks impresive


Perla117
Joined: Nov 10, 2014

The Last Italian On This Forum


Posted: Oct 6, 2015 02:20 PM    Msg. 34 of 34       
Thanks Man :)

 

 
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