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Author Topic: A way to edit the fixed function camo shader? (29 messages, Page 1 of 1)
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stunt_man
Joined: Sep 22, 2009

GMYF - Now hosting proper MLG gametypes!


Posted: Feb 23, 2016 09:20 AM    Msg. 1 of 29       
Hello,

I am looking for a way to modify the fixed-function camo shader. Does anyone know if this can be done via tag editing? Or if it requires a client-side modification?

The settings in the globals tag seems to only affect the shiny camo shader.

Thanks


altis94
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

Join my Discord https://discord.gg/GDVEaRD


Posted: Feb 23, 2016 10:58 AM    Msg. 2 of 29       
As far as I know those few global settings and one bitmap is all you can edit.


stunt_man
Joined: Sep 22, 2009

GMYF - Now hosting proper MLG gametypes!


Posted: Feb 23, 2016 01:43 PM    Msg. 3 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: altis94
one bitmap


Bitmap you say? Where is this bitmap?
Edited by stunt_man on Feb 23, 2016 at 01:43 PM


altis94
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

Join my Discord https://discord.gg/GDVEaRD


Posted: Feb 23, 2016 01:52 PM    Msg. 4 of 29       
rasterizer/active camouflage distortion


NeX
Joined: Apr 11, 2013


Posted: Feb 23, 2016 02:22 PM    Msg. 5 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: altis94
rasterizer/active camouflage distortion


Still in the globals file though.

I've played with it a few times, but I've always ended up reverting to original.

Honestly just playing with the values should be better than trying to change the distortion bitmap, unless you're making a new one from scratch at higher resolution.


stunt_man
Joined: Sep 22, 2009

GMYF - Now hosting proper MLG gametypes!


Posted: Feb 23, 2016 03:38 PM    Msg. 6 of 29       
Just to clarify: I am wondering what exactly determines the camo effect for players that don't have the level of pixel shading enabled that is required for the nice camo effect. For example, watch this clip of a player that can't see the "shiny" ATI-style camo:

http://www.twitch.tv/hypecs/v/48304005?t=35m57s

(clip should start at the correct timestamp, but if not it's a little after 35:57)

To give some context: as part of my project to bring the PC version of the game closer to the Xbox version, I made the "shiny" camo effect less visible. In the above clip, this "camo buff" makes no difference, because the player isn't seeing the shiny camo effect.

I am trying to find a way to alter the way that camo is rendered for users that can't see the proper camo effect. If it is based off a bitmap, maybe the alpha channel determines the opacity of the effect for such players. I'll look into it and will happily accept any more advice that you guys send my way.

thanks
Edited by stunt_man on Feb 23, 2016 at 03:43 PM


altis94
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

Join my Discord https://discord.gg/GDVEaRD


Posted: Feb 23, 2016 03:53 PM    Msg. 7 of 29       
I don't think changing anything tagswise could fix that problem. Wasn't 1.10 update supposed to fix this? Did you try messing around with tint color?
Edited by altis94 on Feb 23, 2016 at 03:54 PM


OrangeJuice
Joined: Jan 29, 2009

new content isn't a mod. hhtmods are mods.


Posted: Feb 23, 2016 04:05 PM    Msg. 8 of 29       
He disabled his Alpha-Render-Targets.
Retardedly shiny levels, fixed-function camo, missing detail maps, and vehicles with completely opaque windows are a telltale signs
Edited by OrangeJuice on Feb 23, 2016 at 04:07 PM


stunt_man
Joined: Sep 22, 2009

GMYF - Now hosting proper MLG gametypes!


Posted: Feb 23, 2016 04:38 PM    Msg. 9 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: OrangeJuice

He disabled his Alpha-Render-Targets.
Retardedly shiny levels, fixed-function camo, missing detail maps, and vehicles with completely opaque windows are a telltale signs
Edited by OrangeJuice on Feb 23, 2016 at 04:07 PM


The player in that clip I posted is not using that setting (DART), you can tell because the environment shaders aren't shiny. There's obviously no way to prevent players from using DART settings, which is why I'm trying to find another way to bring their camo effect on par with what other players are seeing.

It's hard to take a match seriously when camo is useless against some players.

Quote: --- Original message by: altis94

I don't think changing anything tagswise could fix that problem. Wasn't 1.10 update supposed to fix this? Did you try messing around with tint color?
Edited by altis94 on Feb 23, 2016 at 03:54 PM


I'm going to try to really dive into this tonight. The only value I messed with was refraction amount (default 11 pixels, jacked up to 30 pixels on my Xbox versions of the maps, which makes it much harder to see). You might be on to something with tint color, I'll post my findings here later.
Edited by stunt_man on Feb 23, 2016 at 04:41 PM


Super Flanker
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

The length of your life depends on my aim.


Posted: Feb 24, 2016 11:11 AM    Msg. 10 of 29       
bump.


stunt_man
Joined: Sep 22, 2009

GMYF - Now hosting proper MLG gametypes!


Posted: Feb 24, 2016 12:15 PM    Msg. 11 of 29       
Thanks for the bump.

After looking into this last night, there appears to be no way to modify the fixed function camo effect.

DART players officially have an advantage against players who play with normal settings in my Xbox versions of the maps available on my servers.

Here is a video demonstrating the difference:

https://youtu.be/UjjI8sa3BFQ


Super Flanker
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

The length of your life depends on my aim.


Posted: Feb 24, 2016 12:41 PM    Msg. 12 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Thanks for the bump.

After looking into this last night, there appears to be no way to modify the fixed function camo effect.

DART players officially have an advantage against players who play with normal settings in my Xbox versions of the maps available on my servers.

Here is a video demonstrating the difference:

https://youtu.be/UjjI8sa3BFQ


Huh, the difference between pc and xbox is so huge I genuinely thought you were nit picking.


stunt_man
Joined: Sep 22, 2009

GMYF - Now hosting proper MLG gametypes!


Posted: Feb 24, 2016 02:35 PM    Msg. 13 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: Super Flanker
Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Thanks for the bump.

After looking into this last night, there appears to be no way to modify the fixed function camo effect.

DART players officially have an advantage against players who play with normal settings in my Xbox versions of the maps available on my servers.

Here is a video demonstrating the difference:

https://youtu.be/UjjI8sa3BFQ


Huh, the difference between pc and xbox is so huge I genuinely thought you were nit picking.


Yeah the difference is significant.

Upon ripping the Xbox tags, I noticed that the Refraction Amount setting (the value that was modified to make it harder to see in my modded maps) was the same on PC and Xbox. But, people playing on Xbox were a) not playing on HD screens and b) playing split screen. I also suspect that the Xbox GPU renders the effect differently, since even on fullscreen/480i the effect is harder to see on Xbox.

Yet another oversight from Gearbox.


Super Flanker
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

The length of your life depends on my aim.


Posted: Feb 24, 2016 03:21 PM    Msg. 14 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Quote: --- Original message by: Super Flanker
Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Thanks for the bump.

After looking into this last night, there appears to be no way to modify the fixed function camo effect.

DART players officially have an advantage against players who play with normal settings in my Xbox versions of the maps available on my servers.

Here is a video demonstrating the difference:

https://youtu.be/UjjI8sa3BFQ


Huh, the difference between pc and xbox is so huge I genuinely thought you were nit picking.


Yeah the difference is significant.

Upon ripping the Xbox tags, I noticed that the Refraction Amount setting (the value that was modified to make it harder to see in my modded maps) was the same on PC and Xbox. But, people playing on Xbox were a) not playing on HD screens and b) playing split screen. I also suspect that the Xbox GPU renders the effect differently, since even on fullscreen/480i the effect is harder to see on Xbox.

Yet another oversight from Gearbox.


Out of curiosity what tools do you use to rip xbox tags?


stunt_man
Joined: Sep 22, 2009

GMYF - Now hosting proper MLG gametypes!


Posted: Feb 24, 2016 06:22 PM    Msg. 15 of 29       
Arsenic. But it only reads decompressed map files, so you need DotHalo to decompress first.


Super Flanker
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

The length of your life depends on my aim.


Posted: Feb 25, 2016 07:45 AM    Msg. 16 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Arsenic. But it only reads decompressed map files, so you need DotHalo to decompress first.


Sounds tricky.


stunt_man
Joined: Sep 22, 2009

GMYF - Now hosting proper MLG gametypes!


Posted: Feb 25, 2016 08:34 AM    Msg. 17 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: Super Flanker
Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Arsenic. But it only reads decompressed map files, so you need DotHalo to decompress first.


Sounds tricky.


Nah it's easy. It's useful for when you want to compare values and stuff, but its usefulness ends there. Arsenic is more useful to the Xbox map makers who use it to recompile their PC maps with an Xbox tagset.


Super Flanker
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

The length of your life depends on my aim.


Posted: Feb 25, 2016 08:50 AM    Msg. 18 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Quote: --- Original message by: Super Flanker
Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Arsenic. But it only reads decompressed map files, so you need DotHalo to decompress first.


Sounds tricky.


Nah it's easy. It's useful for when you want to compare values and stuff, but its usefulness ends there. Arsenic is more useful to the Xbox map makers who use it to recompile their PC maps with an Xbox tagset.


Speaking of tagsets will you be leaving your maps unprotected or would you consider possibly releasing your remastered files once your project reaches completion?


stunt_man
Joined: Sep 22, 2009

GMYF - Now hosting proper MLG gametypes!


Posted: Feb 25, 2016 09:46 AM    Msg. 19 of 29       
Hell no I won't protect my maps, goes against what this community is built on.

That's not a bad idea, maybe I'll release an Xbox tagset so people can use all the same fixes for their maps.
Edited by stunt_man on Feb 25, 2016 at 09:47 AM


Super Flanker
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

The length of your life depends on my aim.


Posted: Feb 25, 2016 09:47 AM    Msg. 20 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Hell no I won't protect my maps, goes against what this community is built on.


So glad you said this.


stunt_man
Joined: Sep 22, 2009

GMYF - Now hosting proper MLG gametypes!


Posted: Feb 25, 2016 09:49 AM    Msg. 21 of 29       
Does anyone still bother to protect their maps? I thought we were past that.


NeX
Joined: Apr 11, 2013


Posted: Feb 25, 2016 11:20 AM    Msg. 22 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Does anyone still bother to protect their maps? I thought we were past that.


You would think so, seriously.

I actually somewhat enjoy seeing stuff I've put together in other maps, credited or not. Even the yonlex ones (am I in the club now?)


Super Flanker
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

The length of your life depends on my aim.


Posted: Feb 25, 2016 11:29 AM    Msg. 23 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: NeX
Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Does anyone still bother to protect their maps? I thought we were past that.


You would think so, seriously.

I actually somewhat enjoy seeing stuff I've put together in other maps, credited or not. Even the yonlex ones (am I in the club now?)


Where as I deplore any work which doesn't directly credit what I or anyone else has contributed to someone elses map. (Unless its a beta)

I mean I get its not so easy to keep track of who and to what every single tag belongs to in your respective maps which is why wihin the readme (if people still bother to make ones these days) I'd be perfectly happy with:

"Oh and thanks to anyone else who may have contributed to this project sorry I forgot your name"

This is pretty much credit at its simplest form yet it still counts (imao) because I have been achknowledged for my efforts even if I wasn't named directly.

It's also nice to know that the author of said proyect still appreciates me even though he/she cannot reflect on who I actually am and how I specifically helped.


Rant over.


stunt_man
Joined: Sep 22, 2009

GMYF - Now hosting proper MLG gametypes!


Posted: Feb 26, 2016 11:13 AM    Msg. 24 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: Super Flanker
Quote: --- Original message by: NeX
Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Does anyone still bother to protect their maps? I thought we were past that.


You would think so, seriously.

I actually somewhat enjoy seeing stuff I've put together in other maps, credited or not. Even the yonlex ones (am I in the club now?)


Where as I deplore any work which doesn't directly credit what I or anyone else has contributed to someone elses map. (Unless its a beta)

I mean I get its not so easy to keep track of who and to what every single tag belongs to in your respective maps which is why wihin the readme (if people still bother to make ones these days) I'd be perfectly happy with:

"Oh and thanks to anyone else who may have contributed to this project sorry I forgot your name"

This is pretty much credit at its simplest form yet it still counts (imao) because I have been achknowledged for my efforts even if I wasn't named directly.

It's also nice to know that the author of said proyect still appreciates me even though he/she cannot reflect on who I actually am and how I specifically helped.


Rant over.


I don't know man, with HAC2 and HEK+ lots of people might not even know where certain tags or maps come from. As long as someone doesn't blatantly say "I created this map/tag" I really don't care whether I'm credited or not.


Super Flanker
Joined: Oct 5, 2012

The length of your life depends on my aim.


Posted: Feb 26, 2016 11:26 AM    Msg. 25 of 29       


I guess I just think to highly of my own crap :D
Edited by Super Flanker on Feb 26, 2016 at 11:27 AM


stunt_man
Joined: Sep 22, 2009

GMYF - Now hosting proper MLG gametypes!


Posted: Feb 26, 2016 12:59 PM    Msg. 26 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: Super Flanker



I guess I just think to highly of my own crap :D
Edited by Super Flanker on Feb 26, 2016 at 11:27 AM


Absolutely nothing wrong with that.

But by using map protection as a means to prevent thieves from using your work, many legit content creators lose access to it and overall I'd say it does more harm than good.


MrChromed
Joined: Apr 14, 2013

Developer on SPv3 and ShadowMods Team.


Posted: Feb 29, 2016 04:26 PM    Msg. 27 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Here is a video demonstrating the difference:
https://youtu.be/UjjI8sa3BFQ


I asked something in the video, but it seems like nobody read it, so I will quote it here:

"Excellent way to show the differences between each configuration. Btw, I have a question: How did you get the same camera position in every comparision?. Somy kind of software?. Thanks for reading".
Edited by Isxz on Feb 29, 2016 at 04:27 PM


stunt_man
Joined: Sep 22, 2009

GMYF - Now hosting proper MLG gametypes!


Posted: Feb 29, 2016 04:56 PM    Msg. 28 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: Isxz

Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Here is a video demonstrating the difference:
https://youtu.be/UjjI8sa3BFQ


I asked something in the video, but it seems like nobody read it, so I will quote it here:

"Excellent way to show the differences between each configuration. Btw, I have a question: How did you get the same camera position in every comparision?. Somy kind of software?. Thanks for reading".
Edited by Isxz on Feb 29, 2016 at 04:27 PM


debug_camera_save
debug_camera_load

When you say a debug camera, it will remain at those coordinates even if you close the game, until you re-save a new debug camera.


MrChromed
Joined: Apr 14, 2013

Developer on SPv3 and ShadowMods Team.


Posted: Feb 29, 2016 05:09 PM    Msg. 29 of 29       
Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Quote: --- Original message by: Isxz

Quote: --- Original message by: stunt_man
Here is a video demonstrating the difference:
https://youtu.be/UjjI8sa3BFQ


I asked something in the video, but it seems like nobody read it, so I will quote it here:

"Excellent way to show the differences between each configuration. Btw, I have a question: How did you get the same camera position in every comparision?. Somy kind of software?. Thanks for reading".
Edited by Isxz on Feb 29, 2016 at 04:27 PM


debug_camera_save
debug_camera_load

When you say a debug camera, it will remain at those coordinates even if you close the game, until you re-save a new debug camera.


I always used debug_camera_save/load in the past (until devcam 0/1 came out on HAC2), but I never knew that "trick". Thank you so much, it will be very useful to me

 

 
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