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Author Topic: Consistency With Weapon Detonation Effects (10 messages, Page 1 of 1)
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BioGoji1989
Joined: Dec 24, 2017

Professional Idiot


Posted: May 12, 2019 02:10 PM    Msg. 1 of 10       
Having recently created a Covenant Pistol and Covenant SMG for level c40 of my campaign mod, I have noticed that there are some inconsistencies with the detonation effect of the dropped SMG weapon.

I have made sure to create a detonation effect that spawns the regular version of the weapon when the Jackals holding it drop their version, and I have made sure that the weapon detonates when dropped as well. During the early encounters in the level, there appear to be no problems, but near the final stages of the level, after exiting the underground tunnel near the final pulse generator, I noticed that I was able to pick up 2 SMG weapons at the same time following a battle between Covenant and Flood AI, which should not happen because of the detonation effect for the Covenant SMG.

I have since rechecked the weapon tags using Mozzarilla, and the properties of the Covenant SMG have the weapon marked as detonates when dropped. Does anyone have any answers as to why this is possible?
Edited by BioGoji1989 on May 12, 2019 at 02:11 PM


sparky
Joined: Jun 27, 2009

Dismissal of Truth leaves one to believe lies


Posted: May 12, 2019 10:24 PM    Msg. 2 of 10       
If there is one scenario in the map, and you're certain that the weapon tag that your character is holding is what you think it is, then it might be due to the type of terrain material onto which it is being dropped or maybe has to do with some kind of scripting bug. Check through the globals.globals tag and see if swapping in your weapon with an existing weapon in the weapon list makes the problem go away. Otherwise, show a video demonstration and/or upload the map itself to someone who can go through and check through its tags. I haven't tried that bitmask flag -- what happens with a covenant sword? What kind of detonation effect do you have? Does the detonation effect actually trigger when it touches the ground? Does the detonation effect use a damage effect tag? It's hard for me to guess what might be causing this particular issue without seeing it or having the map to experiment with for you.

If there are two different weapon tags, you will be able to carry both at the same time. And if a weapon is marked as required (cannot be dropped) then it takes up an extra slot. One example of using that flag is for always having a pair of fists as your always-carried weapon; so you can always switch to fists, like the fists from the Marathon series games. I'm not sure if Refinery is incorrect in some way. Is it the same flag checked when you open the map using Eschaton with sparky's plugins?
Edited by sparky on May 12, 2019 at 10:28 PM


BioGoji1989
Joined: Dec 24, 2017

Professional Idiot


Posted: May 12, 2019 10:46 PM    Msg. 3 of 10       
Quote: --- Original message by: sparky

If there is one scenario in the map, and you're certain that the weapon tag that your character is holding is what you think it is, then it might be due to the type of terrain material onto which it is being dropped or maybe has to do with some kind of scripting bug. Check through the globals.globals tag and see if swapping in your weapon with an existing weapon in the weapon list makes the problem go away. Otherwise, show a video demonstration and/or upload the map itself to someone who can go through and check through its tags. I haven't tried that bitmask flag -- what happens with a covenant sword? What kind of detonation effect do you have? Does the detonation effect actually trigger when it touches the ground? Does the detonation effect use a damage effect tag? It's hard for me to guess what might be causing this particular issue without seeing it or having the map to experiment with for you.

If there are two different weapon tags, you will be able to carry both at the same time. And if a weapon is marked as required (cannot be dropped) then it takes up an extra slot. One example of using that flag is for always having a pair of fists as your always-carried weapon; so you can always switch to fists, like the fists from the Marathon series games. I'm not sure if Refinery is incorrect in some way. Is it the same flag checked when you open the map using Eschaton with sparky's plugins?
Edited by sparky on May 12, 2019 at 10:28 PM


Basically, I have an SMG labeled as a needler so that Jackals can use it. The detonation tag is essentially this: the weapon falls to the ground, disappears, and the regular SMG is spawned almost instantaneously. The effect is pretty much impossible to see without frame-by-frame examination, and that's the point. The problem is that the Covenant SMG should not be usable by the player once it is dropped. It should completely disappear and the regular SMG should take its place.

The reason that this situation is a little problematic is that I have the SMG jackals only appearing near the very end of the mission, meaning that I don't know if this issue is related to the terrain material in that section of the bsp, or if it is indeed a scripting error as you have suggested. I'm going to check the globals.globals tag, as you've suggested, as well as the encounters portion of the scenario tag so that the SMG jackals appear sooner, and then test that out after compiling the map again. If the problem persists, I will upload the level onto mediafire and give you a download link so that you may inspect it and test it out yourself if you so desire.


DeadHamster
Joined: Jun 8, 2014

https://discord.gg/Neu4EJM


Posted: May 13, 2019 05:03 AM    Msg. 4 of 10       


You need to delete your crazy exploding SMG, give the normal one to the jackals and edit one value in the jackals Actor_Variant tag.


BioGoji1989
Joined: Dec 24, 2017

Professional Idiot


Posted: May 13, 2019 09:38 AM    Msg. 5 of 10       
Quote: --- Original message by: DeadHamster
https://i.imgur.com/hVINg0N.png

You need to delete your crazy exploding SMG, give the normal one to the jackals and edit one value in the jackals Actor_Variant tag.


The SMG doesn't explode. It simply disappears. After all... YOU were the one who provided the instructions for how to make this work. You made a post in a thread last year when I was asking about a similar topic, and you provided instructions on how to make the weapon used by the enemy AI disappear so that the weapon picked up by the player is the normal one.

Let me refresh your memory.

Quote: --- Original message by: DeadHamster
Quote: --- Original message by: rudeboy13
As long as the weapon has a label assigned to it that their animations are compatible with, there shouldn't be any problems. If you want to play it safe then change their weapon labels to the needler's since every biped that can use weapons can use it.


Every character would then hold every gun as though it was the needler.


Bio, The biped's ability to hold a weapon is based on the character's animation tag. Each animation tag is filled with animations for various poses or events. There are also animations for how each biped holds a weapon; where their hands go basically. A Rocket Launcher is held very different from an Assault Rifle.


The weapons label should match the animation, so if you label a weapon as an assault rifle, it'll be held as an assault rifle by any character able to do so. If a character has no animation for that weapon however, it won't be able to use it.


Which is why I would HIGHLY recommend CMT models and animations for your bipeds, as they can pretty much carry each gun that the biped should. From there, to use your custom weapons you would have to open each weapon tag you want to use, and change the label to match the closest CMT counterpart. The G36, AK-47 can be held like an assault rifle, but the Beretta should be a pistol and the MP5K should probably be an SMG.


As a final note; perhaps the grunt doesn't have an animation for the SMG. To make it an Plasma Pistol label would have every marine and elite hold it wrong, but this means you can't use it for the grunt! Oh no, what to do? Easy! Copy ONLY the weapon tag, and rename it SMG_grunt.weapon. Now change the SMG_grunt.weapon's label to plasma pistol, open your grunt's AI and make them hold the SMG_grunt.weapon

Now your regular characters use the SMG, the grunts can still use an SMG_grunt, and since they share ever other asset they'll act identically and you won't be wasting memory space.

The only issue may come that as it's a separate weapon tag, it'll let you hold both, one SMG and one SMG_grunt. For that reason I would open the SMG_grunt.weapon tag and mark the flag in the WEAPONS section that says "detonates when dropped".

Now create a new effect tag; click ADD to EVENTS and ADD to PARTS. On the dropdown go to the bottom and select weapon, and reference the SMG.weapon tag (NOT SMG_GRUNT!!). Save it to the SMG folder. Now back inside the SMG_grunt.weapon tag, scroll a bit further down and find "detonation effect". Reference the tag we just made above.



So now you kill the grunt, he drops his gun. Just like the Plasma Cannons ingame, the gun blows up and is destroyed. It can no longer be picked up. But instead of the plasma cannon's destroyed effect creating blue particles and smoke, we made an effect create an SMG weapon tag with nothing else. The player won't notice as it happens in a fraction of a second with nothing to draw attention. At worst they think the physics flicked if they see a gun move. But now, there's a regular SMG on the floor, after a grunt with an SMG died. So the player won't know that SMG_grunt even exists (which is perfect, because it shouldn't really exist except as a workaround).


Essentially... I learned this from YOU!!!
Edited by BioGoji1989 on May 13, 2019 at 09:41 AM


DeadHamster
Joined: Jun 8, 2014

https://discord.gg/Neu4EJM


Posted: May 13, 2019 10:06 AM    Msg. 6 of 10       
Yeah that was really bad advice. Don't listen to me. Instead you should listen to me;

Animation tag;




Do that. You want to do it not only for Stand, but for Crouch and Flee and Alert. The vehicles won't be important unless your AI use vehicles. Find the weapon that you want it to emulate and duplicate it, then add your label. If you need, you can swap the individual animations from there, to use a different reload for example.


So, delete your crazy exploding SMG, find the weapon label, open your biped's animation tag and make a duplicate in all the appropriate poses, and put that label into each one. Then go into the actor_variant and adjust the damage multiplier. Now your AI can use your weapon and it won't be different from the players.


BioGoji1989
Joined: Dec 24, 2017

Professional Idiot


Posted: May 13, 2019 04:17 PM    Msg. 7 of 10       
Quote: --- Original message by: DeadHamster
Yeah that was really bad advice. Don't listen to me. Instead you should listen to me;

Animation tag;

<a href="https://i.imgur.com/AVLvbHr.png" target="_blank">https://i.imgur.com/AVLvbHr.png</a>


Do that. You want to do it not only for Stand, but for Crouch and Flee and Alert. The vehicles won't be important unless your AI use vehicles. Find the weapon that you want it to emulate and duplicate it, then add your label. If you need, you can swap the individual animations from there, to use a different reload for example.


So, delete your crazy exploding SMG, find the weapon label, open your biped's animation tag and make a duplicate in all the appropriate poses, and put that label into each one. Then go into the actor_variant and adjust the damage multiplier. Now your AI can use your weapon and it won't be different from the players.


Hm... interesting. However, upon inspecting the animations tag for various bipeds, I discovered that the fuel rod elites from Project Lumoria have what appear to be animations for holding two-handed weapons, such as the Flame Thrower, Rocket Launcher, and even the Assault Rifle, with ar, rl, ft, pc, and sg appearing in the weapons type array available to them. Having not attempted to use the Lumoria Elites for anything except plasma cannons, I am going to see if I can make them use those weapons in my 1.75 mod, or even this one itself. Thank you for inadvertently leading me to this discovery.

However, on a related note, are there any CMT grunt and jackal tags that don't use OpenSauce? I'd like to perhaps use newer Grunt and Jackal tags for the 2.0 version of the campaign mod when I become even more experimental, but I'm not at the point where I'm ready to make OpenSauce maps and tags just yet.

[EDIT] A few hours later...

It seems that I have spoken too soon. As is usually my luck, I was WRONG about the Lumoria FRG Elite animations tag. Because of course I was wrong. If I weren't, then the world would probably fall apart at the seams.

That being said, when I make my 2.0 campaign mod, I'm hoping that the DMT Halo 2 covenant tags I plan on using can at least hold the magnum without needing special weapon tags and animation tweaking. If only the CMT Elite tags used Halo 2 style armor instead of Halo 3, I would use those without hesitation.
Edited by BioGoji1989 on May 13, 2019 at 04:18 PM
Edited by BioGoji1989 on May 13, 2019 at 04:18 PM
Edited by BioGoji1989 on May 13, 2019 at 05:12 PM


DeadHamster
Joined: Jun 8, 2014

https://discord.gg/Neu4EJM


Posted: May 13, 2019 05:24 PM    Msg. 8 of 10       
Quote: --- Original message by: BioGoji1989
However, on a related note, are there any CMT grunt and jackal tags that don't use OpenSauce? I'd like to perhaps use newer Grunt and Jackal tags for the 2.0 version of the campaign mod when I become even more experimental, but I'm not at the point where I'm ready to make OpenSauce maps and tags just yet.



To make a map with OpenSauce you download OpenSauce, install it, and then instead of saying

tool build-cache-file levels\biogoji\mymapname

you say

os_tool build-cache-file-ex "" 0 0 1 levels\biogoji\mymapname



Tadah. Your scenario is now an opensauce .Yelo mapfile.

So you can get your SPV3/Evolved tags, add them to your scenario using OS_Sapien, and then compile it using OS_Tool. Everything else would be exactly the same. Instead of Guerilla you use OS_Guerilla; instead of Sapien you use OS_Sapien. The upgrades are automatic; if you want to take advantage of Post Processing or Directional Lightmapping THAT'S when things start getting crazy. But to use OS tags you just need to be using the OS tools, which work exactly like the stock.

So, yeah, you are "Ready for OS". You're already making OS maps now, you're just using the wrong version of tool.exe to compile them.


sparky
Joined: Jun 27, 2009

Dismissal of Truth leaves one to believe lies


Posted: May 13, 2019 09:39 PM    Msg. 9 of 10       
Quote: --- Original message by: DeadHamster
.Yelo mapfile


I'd like to remind and point out that the file extension differs because the file format differs. .yelo means not compatible with stock Halo Custom Edition. Use tools deliberately.


BioGoji1989
Joined: Dec 24, 2017

Professional Idiot


Posted: May 14, 2019 02:12 PM    Msg. 10 of 10       
Quote: --- Original message by: sparky
Quote: --- Original message by: DeadHamster
.Yelo mapfile


I'd like to remind and point out that the file extension differs because the file format differs. .yelo means not compatible with stock Halo Custom Edition. Use tools deliberately.


That's a good point. That's why I'm looking for non-OS tags right now.

 

 
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